Keto diet: Keto Diet. I would appriciate... - Healthy Eating

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Keto diet

parrish profile image
parrish

Keto Diet. I would appriciate some advice. I am on 3 different blood pressure meds, cholesterol meds and blood thinning. I recently was advised that my blood sugar was starting to get high and my blood pressure was also steadily starting to rise.

I have started on a Keto diet and so far my blood pressure is going down each day and is now 120/80. I don't feel hungry and I am steadily loosing weight. I am regularly walking. My main concern is the cholesterol side of things as I am not testing if it has risen. I would like to remain on the diet as it seems to be sustainable for me.

28 Replies
Penel profile image
PenelModerator

Hi

These might be useful articles to read.

healthline.com/health/food-...

healthline.com/nutrition/lo...

Hi

There is a LCHF forum on here, they maybe able to help.

Best wishes

Peanut31

parrish profile image
parrish in reply to Peanut31

Thankyou for the reply I will have a look at the forum

Hidden profile image
Hidden

say hello to the guy's on the LCHF forum, there very helpful..

healthunlocked.com/lchf-diet

🙂

Activity2004 profile image
Activity2004Administrator

Welcome to the group.

Please check out the Topics section for Keto meals/ideas. You can always ask questions, check out the polls and Pinned Posts sections.

Have you checked the LCHF Diabetes group also on HU? healthunlocked.com/lchf-dia...

The ICS-NHS Diabetes Prevention Programme asserts that harmful, dense LDL comes from eating excess carbohydrate.

Focussing on lowering saturated fat has been at least a waste of time (the UK as a whole only eat 1% above what is recommended), and if people are lulled into eating excess carbohydrate as a 'safe alternative', is detrimental. The Perfect Health Diet cites evidence that the ideal carb intake for most people is between 480 kcal and 640 kcal per day.

Of course, eating too much of anything is bad by definition.

The ideal ratio for fat is that of our body-fat, whether you believe this is God given or a product of evolution; 57% monounsaturated, 40% saturated, and 3% EFAs.

Zest profile image
ZestStar

Hi parrish

I just wanted to welcome you to the Healthy eating forum, and I hope you'll enjoy participating. I can see you've had lots of great replies and information, and I hope you find it helpful. Wishing you a great weekend.

Zest :-)

It is great that the LCHF way of eating works for you! If you are worried for your cholesterol, you can ask your GP for a blood test.

The keto diet is unlikely to reduce cholesterol, in fact, assuming this is meat based keto then your cholesterol may be more likely to rise. If your triglycerides are high as well then keto may not be a good idea long term.

Hidden profile image
Hidden in reply to andyswarbs

I think you should warn those guys on the LCHF forum about this.

healthunlocked.com/lchf-diet

andyswarbs profile image
andyswarbs in reply to Hidden

I put myself in front of enough flames as it is! over recent months I have been having a detailed spat on "science" based medicine website who insist that my recovery from arthritis was spontaneous, mostly because their minds are a closed book. It is hard when you (well me) face off against a barrage of people who come at you with a stream of poor arguments. I never do this to win a popularity contest. My hope in putting myself out there is to find

a) the common ground (which includes reducing refined foods to an absolute minimum.)

b) understanding the strengths and weaknesses of LCHF vs HCLF for the benefit of all.

c) clarification of definitions. For example someone following a keto diet may not actually be in ketosis since that is a high bar to maintain.

Putting myself in front of the LCHF forum right now would be too much for my brain. I have followed the forum but since its members are generally hard core LCHF I I think they are unlikely to welcome my arguments any more than a can of petrol to a match.

This forum of course is, at least in theory, open to healthy eating debates.

Hidden profile image
Hidden in reply to andyswarbs

good reply..thank you.

Cooper27 profile image
Cooper27Administrator in reply to andyswarbs

If your arthritis was auto-immune, there's a strong theory that autoimmune disease stems from a leaky gut. The immune system first has to battle food particles in the blood, but soon after, it gets confused and thinks that other bodily proteins are a bit too similar to the offending food proteins, and so it attacks those too.

The theory in the functional medicine world is that withdrawing the trigger, should prevent the attack, and allow the body & gut to heal.

It's a wall many of us with other autoimmune diseases come up against too: doctors don't think it's possible to reverse the symptoms of autoimmune disease with food choices (except coeliac disease). They just say to go away and put up with it, because there isn't a pill you can be prescribed. I think doctors are gradually adapting to this way of thinking though.

For me, it looks like my trigger might be dairy. Dairy is a very common one, after gluten.

andyswarbs profile image
andyswarbs in reply to Cooper27

Spot on.

Dairy, eggs and nightshade plants were my major triggers. I think even non-autoimmune can be helped by significant dietary improvements.

parrish profile image
parrish in reply to andyswarbs

sorry what do you mean by night shade plants

Cooper27 profile image
Cooper27Administrator in reply to parrish

Nightshades are a group of vegetables, they include white potatoes, aubergines, peppers (incl. chilli peppers), courgettes and tomatoes, among other things. If you google them, it'll show you the full list.

They are believed to be inflammatory plants, so if you're trying to cut down inflammation in the body (e.g. during cancer treatment), then they suggest avoiding them. On a list of trigger foods, they're quite low down the list (maybe 5% of people with autoimmune disease struggle with them, compared to about 80% who struggle with gluten).

parrish profile image
parrish in reply to Cooper27

Ok thanks, yet again I've learned something new.

andyswarbs profile image
andyswarbs in reply to parrish

Nightshade plants infamously include the most famous nightshade of them all Atropa belladonna, woodlandtrust.org.uk/visiti... and of course no normal human being wants to eat that plant! More importantly tomatoes and potatoes are included. Also included are other vegetables/fruit including gooseberries, rhubarb. Also common spices include paprika, cayenne etc.

What they all have in common is a chemical called solanine which is a mild natural toxin that causes nausea and other intestinal upsets. The plant family name is solanaceae. Rather than an all or nothing what seems important for most people is the quantities injested. Tomatoes have relatively high levels. Potatoes can be high as well but most of it is near the skin, so well peeled potatoes tend to have small quantities.

StillConcerned profile image
StillConcerned in reply to Hidden

These points have been raised before. The cholesterol theory is flawed because it ignores evidence from the NHS DPP that it is excess carbohydrate that forms the harmful VLDL. Whilst cholesterol levels can sometimes rise with LCHF, HDL also goes up, therefore the overall effect would be at least neutral and tend to be beneficial since it will improve the TC:HDL ratio.

As for trigs, it is basic biochemistry that triglycerides (as the name implies) are three fatty acids bound by a carbohydrate backbone. It necessitates three times as many fatty acids for each carbohydrate to form one of these molecules. If we use the simplified 9kcal per gramme accepted fat value compared to 4 kcal per gramme of carbohydrate, that would mean for each 4 kcal less of carbohydrate you take 27 kcal of fatty acids out of commission. I.e. reducing carbohydrate is far more effective at lowering triglycerides, and this is borne out in practice, not least because excess carbohydrate results in de novo lipogenesis which is all too prevalent societally.

Now, I'm not a fan of long-term keto, but the ideal intake of carbohydrate for most people is only half the RDA. The RDA was arrived at to discourage people eating fat, and is again based on a flawed theory. It does not take into account the effect of carbohydrates on our hormones, nor the fact that our guts are not equipped to cope with as much vegetation as other great apes.

Hidden profile image
Hidden in reply to StillConcerned

I have had high cholesterol for well over 20 years..but all the doctors I've seen don't seem to be worried about it. and I have never been worried about it.

when my doctor told me I had high cholesterol and prescribed satins but at the same time said he wasn't worried about it... on my return home I ask questions about it to two of my neighbour's who are both doctors/proffers in medicine and both said to take the satins regularly... I didn't believe i needed them and thought of the doctors were just following guidelines.

my brother inlaw had been on satins for years and thought me crazy for not taking them..

he died two years later from a heart attack...end off.

personally I believe what you say is a 100% ture. so thanks for taking the time to reply.

I think the cholesterol theory understands VLDL and does not ignore it. Models need refining over time. For example heart attacks being caused by blood clots is not quite right. Most attacks do not occur until the artery is over 90% blocked. This is because the body finds alternative, smaller, routes to guarantee blood supply. It does this incredibly successfully. Something needs to happen to the plaque to trigger the attack. I forget the next stage off the top of my head. But of course the consequences for the person are awful because the chronic illness has been building in the body for many years, if not decades until we reach a "straw and the camels back" moment.

My keto experience has been that my triglycerides went way down and my cholesterol stayed the same. It's high--it was always high.

Anyway, good or bad, keto hasn't changed it. The pattern (large fluffy vs small dense) is good now, but unfortunately I don't know what it was before because I never had it tested.

My blood sugar went way down (from prediabetic to almost below normal) as did my insulin. I've lost about 60 lbs and kept it off for ten years.

BTW I would say I use mostly olive oil, avocado oil second, and butter last. But I use plenty of full cream and eat plenty of eggs and high fat cheese.

Thanks for all the replys. I haven't read anything that has put me off the low carb high fat thing. I intend to not make it hard work for myself as to sustain it as a Life style change I think it needs to be simple. I intend to get my cholesterol checked when I get back to the UK but that won't be for a couple of months. I still feel like it's a bit of an experiment but I am going to give it a longer try.

Penel profile image
PenelModerator in reply to parrish

Keep going and good luck! It’s definitely worth trying.

My husbands cholesterol levels (and mine) are fine on low carb.

I've done the same as you, and I'm similar meds. I've been keto for about 18 months. Everything has improved, blood make-up, blood pressure, weight, leaner, fitter, more alert (mind you, that wasn't hard 😁). After 6 months my cholesterol had stayed the same at less than 4 overall figure, but good cholesterol had improved. At a year it had gone up to low 5's. I've read it can be temporary and unless you're overeating, of eating far too much meat etc, it should come down again as your system gets used to the changes.

Due another test in a few months, so that'll be interesting. I'm not worried with cholesterol at around 5 though. I'm a 70 year old male.

parrish, just remember that the liver makes cholesterol if we don't consume enough, so isn't it odd that doctors try to lower it?

Also, how did they come up with the levels for cholesterol? How do we know that what they consider to be high cholesterol isn't in fact normal?

I have a female friend who's 71 (looks 50), not a thing wrong with her. Latest check-up her doctor (NHS) tells her she has a (wait for it) 12% chance of having a heart attack and (wait for it) would she like to go on statins. She politely declined, although she couldn't hide the "Are you crazy??" expression. I would have asked the doc how she came up with 12%. And if there was a 12% chance she was crazy.

Keto? Rock on! \m/ :)

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