Questions after 3 failed embryo transfers

[Sloop14]

hi all! You guys have been a wonderful supportive group. I just got my results that my 3rd FET has ended in a chemical pregnancy. This is my third transfer and they have all failed. I am meeting with my RE next week to discuss next steps forward. We have 2 embryos still frozen that are tested normal. However, they aren' t great quality. We have another round of IVF already paid for if we need to go that route. My question is does anybody have some questions that they would ask their doctor to help guide the next steps? Any input would be much appreciated feeling very down at this point.

[Miracle43]

Hi Sloop14,

I’ve just had another failed Cycle too.

I’m thinking about testing for NK cells, maybe it’s something you could ask? Other possible question would be a sperm fragmentation test.

Hope this helps, I’m interested in any other questions you have too.

Hope you are ok 🥰 xx

[Core]

Hi, I’m so sorry to hear about your latest result. I’ve had 5 failed transfers and 1 that ended in early miscarriage with the one that was positive I took steroids and heparin but then I had a BFN after so not sure if they contributed. My doctor has always said it’s a numbers game and no other tests or treatment have enough evidence. Easier said than done but I am trying to trust them and not Google too much, after all they want it to work as much as I do and they are the experts so I would just ask them if there’s anything else to try/tests to have. Good luck xx

[Hidden]

Sorry to hear about your journey so far, its so difficult.

I have to agree with Core, throughout the rollercoaster my clinic just tell me its a case of going and going and eventually one will stick. Its human nature to look for a reason why things havent worked but with IVF whilst sometimes there is a reason more often than not its just that dreaded 'luck' word. I have suggested every test under the sun to my consultant but he has dismissed most of them as money spinners for the drugs companies and most don't have extensive proven results. The one thing we did try last round was a different embryo glue which is supposed to work in certain circumstances called Embryogen. It didnt work last time but tbh the embryos were really poor quality due to sperm issues so would have taken a lot to make them stick.

The one thing I would say is you do get a slightly skewed view of IVF on this forum, there is a lot of focus on embryo grades and additional tests you could be doing. I have been on here for years and I would say I have probably seen as many BFPs from lesser quality embryos than I have from super top grade embryos, if not more! A friend of mine had 9 rounds and her 9th was her worst embryo on ice and that embryo is now 3, another friend had 7 rounds and again her 7th round was her last truly rubbish couple of embryos and one of those is now 2.

I really hope your consultant has some suggestions and you find the strength for the next round and its your BFP xx

[Sloop14 in reply to Hidden]

Thank you so much for this message! I wish they wouldn't even tell me the embryo grades because then we view them as failures before they even go in!

[F_J_762301]

Hey sloop , sorry to hear you have had a rubbish time. It all seems so unfair doesnt it. After going through 4 transfers ( 1 mc and 3 failed) i can completely relate to that awful feeling of being so down and not knowing how to pick yourself up to go on. But you can do it, it will just take a little time to build yourself back up again.

Have you had thyroid and thrombophilia screening? We also had karyotype blood test but you said your remaining embryos have tested normal so does that mean you have had them PGD tested? We have 3 remaining embryos (chose not to have them tested) and have instead chose to go down the ERA/Alice/Emma testing route. Have looked at NK biopsy test but not had this, consultant felt ERA was a bettter choice for us. Its a lot to take in really. Hope this helps a little bit xxx

[Sloop14 in reply to F_J_762301]

yes, I have had that screening done and all was normal. I am doing a natural route since I do not respond to estrogen at all so my doctor says an ERA can't be done with a natural cycle. Thank you so much for your response

[F_J_762301 in reply to Sloop14]

Yes true i was told you have to be able to replicate the cycle exactly for it to be effective.

What about the alice and emma testing seperately tho? Emma tests the endometrial microbiome balance and alice tests specifically for chronic endometriosis. Worth a google and a look into maybe? Good luck with whatever comes next xx

[hifer]

Gosh so sorry to hear this. It’s so tough isn’t it. If only there was a magic potion! I don’t have any good advice I’m afraid and would be interested to hear what your consultant says. It’s such a numbers game and a bit of luck is what you need. I can completely understand why you feel down and sending you lots of hugs to continue on xx

[Sloop14 in reply to hifer]

I know! My husband wants answers and I keep telling him its all just trial and error and hope it works.

[LCharlton]

Really sorry to hear you had a chemical pregnancy. It sounds to me like potentially you're having some issues with embryos implanting? If it was me, I would ask the consultant what might be getting in the way of implantation and if there's anything you can investigate about that xx

[Sloop14 in reply to LCharlton]

Perfect, will add that to my list! Thank you

[leo1980]

Really sorry Sloop14 to hear your news. I feel your devastation. Just going to add in my penny’s worth. If it is recurrent implantation failure, like the ladies mentioned, try and have a look at immunology issues. No can send some stuff to read which is where I am at too in this journey. The testing the ladies recommended are above are a good starting point. Maybe leave the killer one for last as it’s super expensive but the thrombiphia ones you can do at your GP so alreast you can rule those out. We are doing the fragmentation test (comet) next week to evaluate if hubby has any issues - he has only 1% normal sperm anyway. Every cycle is so different I too believe it’s a numbers game. Don’t give up until the yet.

[Sloop14 in reply to leo1980]

if my husband had sperm fragmentation issues would the embryos test chromasomally normal? I don't know anything about this test. So far we have been told all of our blood work, genetic testing and semen analysis is normal. So frustrating!

[GiantPanda]

So sorry to hear this Sloop. I've no advice I'm afraid, but sending you hugs. Xx

[Sloop14 in reply to GiantPanda]

thank you! I hope you have a very smooth pregnancy!

[articsnowfox]

As another poster suggested, I would ask your consultant about doing an ERA test.

[Sloop14 in reply to articsnowfox]

Since I am doing a natural cycle my doctor says an ERA test was not a choice. Not sure why?

[articsnowfox in reply to Sloop14]

Since an ERA test is to find out the optimal duration of progesterone before you transfer the embryo, I am not sure why it matters whether the progesterone comes from the corpus luteum (natural FET) or from pessaries (medicated FET)? This study of ERA testing included patients undergoing a modified natural cycle...

[Sloop14 in reply to articsnowfox]

I will definitely ask about that!

[articsnowfox in reply to Sloop14]

Oops - forgot the study link: ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

[Cinderella5]

Sorry to hear of your struggle, its hard going! Ive had many failed tranfers as well as a chemical pregnancy and a late positive (8 in total). We have had loads of tests done and adjusted small things along the way but recently had an ERA test done which showed my receptivity window was a whole 24 hrs later than other women so I need to start progesterone a whole day before everyone else....6 days before transfer instead of 5. I think its definitely worth looking into to but its not cheap....nothing is with IVF I guess. I havent had success yet and still need to test this theory but it all makes sense on paper.....just gearing up for 9th transfer if covid doesnt rear its ugly head again! All the best.xx

[Sloop14 in reply to Cinderella5]

good luck with the 9th transfer! I didn't respond to estrogen so my doctor has me on a natural cycle so told me that an ERA wasn't possible to do?

[Cinderella5 in reply to Sloop14]

Ahhhh I see, yes that maybe is the case then although I thought they could perhaps still check your lining as to when they would normally put your embryo back to see if your lining was receptive but Im not an expert.xx

[Sloop14 in reply to Cinderella5]

Right? Thats what I was thinking too. I will ask that question in my follow-up. Thank you. And thank you for always being positive and giving everybody a kind word. It is much appreciated

[Cinderella5 in reply to Sloop14]

Always worth an ask, sometimes its better we ask why not instead of accepting a no. Thank you for you kind words, much appreciated. Its nice to be able to support others as I have relied on this group so much over the years....just nice to give back too!xx

[Olivia1980xxx]

Hi In pass year I had one fresh and 3 frozen failure cycles.

The last cycle I had a week ago so yeh no frostie left and one question why.

I all ready booked appointment with doc in few weeks time to discuss next step.

I definitely want to do laparoscopy and thinking of NK cells and repeat other blood tests.

PGS test I will leave last is depending what other tests will say and depends how many embryos I will have if we do fresh cycle.

I will not go through another cycle before I do some investigation.xx

[Jols in reply to Olivia1980xxx]

Hi Olivia, to be honest I have done PGT testing in both my transfers and yet both failed. It just seems like it is a matter of luck in most cases

[Olivia1980xxx in reply to Jols]

Hi hun I had in total 6 cycles.

Only from the second cycle I have a baby girl (she turn 3 in may). I never done PGS test in any of my cycles.

I know ivf is matter of luck is 50/50 ...but I believe in medicine I believe that for everything is some answers too.

I should listen my my self last year and do some more testing more investigation before I lost another embryos...but I go with what they was saying and when I ask for some extra tests they didn’t even try ..they shut me down saying u don’t need it ...let’s try another cycle...Xx

[Jols]

Yes, I hear you. I am on my second failed one with PGT approved, high quality embryo,no uterine issue, good progesterone levels and no gyno issues. I am seriously contemplating going the egg donor route as it does increase the chances by a lot. Good luck with your journey xx