On our first appointment my wife did not make the criteria of 30 BMI as she was 40 BMI. the doctor told us to come back when she loses 30kg.

[chipie]

was hoping if anyone else had the same problem and if we can take this further as naturally my wife is like that and im not sure if she will be able to lose that much but time is on our side as she is 32 and im 38. Thanks and good luck to all you.

[Sarahlf]

I was refused treatment until I lost weight my bmi was around the same they r very strict even after I got my bmi down to 30 it was a little over on my second round and they were going to stop it! I know loosing weight is not easy but your get their for the end result goodluck x

[chipie in reply to Sarahlf]

Thanks for the reply, good to hear you got your bmi down to 30 and i hope it stays around that figure for you. Good luck and best wishes for your treatment and thanks for taking time to reply back. Wish u all the best,

[Jessica888]

I know that it's different for every clinic but I know mine wouldn't do anything until you had lost the weight and I think that is so unfair!! Truly I do!! My friend is trying desperately to loose lots of weight to start IVF, I've watched her do some crazy diets but nothing really works for her and she is gutted. My BMI is 28.5 so I am having to be really careful because the slightest bit of weight gain and they'll put a stop to my treatment!! And if they did I would look at going private.

[chipie in reply to Jessica888]

True say, Homerton Hospital is very strict they told us on our first appointment that they cant go any further until she reached the target. We were dissapointed but my wife is determined to lose weight and luckly we have a threadmill at home so she started running on it. Hopefully slowely but surely we get there. Good luck and best wishes for your treatment and hope all goes well for your friend to lose weight.

[Icklebj2]

I had the same last June. My BMI was 34.4 and I've had to lose weight. My BMI is now 31.8 so going in the right direction! Weight watchers is brilliant- I've lost nearly 2 stone! Good luck!

[chipie in reply to Icklebj2]

Thats nice to hear that your going the right direction and i wish u all the best to reach the target, well done and keep up the good work. Good luck in the future.

[Scooteeder]

Hi "chipie",

Saw your post, and felt that you perhaps needed a bit of support. I don't know how much help my answer will be... it's only my point of view, after all... but here you are, anyway.

You don't say what condition it is that your wife has. However, I assume that it is Gynae in nature, and that it is causing fertility problems - hence your post. Many of the women using this forum have Endometriosis, and similar illnesses, so we can very much identify with your situation.

I have Endo; I've been struggling with it's symptoms for some time, now. I do not know the extent of the damage to my fertility; my first Gynaecologist was utterly incompetent, and never really gave me any advice or assistance. He got my diagnosis wrong, and then failed to treat me. He rarely turned up for appointments (I just had to see Locums), and when I informed him of my long list of symptoms (including chronic pain and fatigue, bloating, water retention, heavy and painful periods, nausea, pelvic pain and cramping) as well as my inability to conceive, he put it all down to "anxiety". Anxiety! I mean... since when did "anxiety" cause water retention, heavy periods and pelvic cramping? The ONLY thing in my life making me anxious was HIM!!

My symptoms had started around 2002, and I was referred to "Mr. Incompetent" in 2006. I did not get a second opinion until 2010, after much arguing and pestering of my G.P. (who was also not helpful). I finally had a first laporoscopy in 2011 and this confirmed Endo. I have since had 2 more, and I'm due a fourth in March. Lovely! (Not!). My Endo seems to be pretty aggressive in nature (deep infiltrating Endo - the most serious type), so I always seem to be fighting to keep it under control. I suspect that this has had a negative effect on fertility.

However, THIS is the frustrating part. I have always been naturally petite (size 8-10). My BMI has always been under 30. From the start of my Gynae problems, my BMI has been monitored. However, I had NEVER until recently been told why. Because of the problems I encountered after being referred to "Mr. Incompetent", I never got the proper chance to discuss fertility, children, or fertility treatments. For YEARS I have been made to choose between having children, and taking treatments to suppress my menstrual problems, but that mess with my fertility. I have been forced (and I do mean forced) by my Doctors to try the Pill and the Mirena Device (they both stop periods, so they mask any Gynae symptoms - they DON'T get rid of them). When I demanded to have the Mirena removed after less than 6 months (because it was causing intense pain, and was also not working) my G.P. insisted that I had to "persist with it" (her own words!).

Every treatment that a woman takes like the Mirena, the Pill or Hormone Injections (Zoladex/Prostrap) messes with her fertility. It fools her body into feeling menopausal, or believing it is pregnant when it is not. Whilst taking such treatment; and often for some time afterwards; a woman CANNOT get pregnant. Her hormones have to adjust back to normal levels again before she can do so. In addition, such treatments have side-effects, one of which is WEIGHT GAIN.

A further problem is that Gynae problems can, themselves, cause WEIGHT GAIN. Things like Polycystic Ovaries and Adenomyosis can cause increased weight. Possibly other illnesses, such as Endo can too. I suspect that the weight gain may be due to a combination of hormonal imbalances, inflammation, and also lack of mobility (caused by pain and fatigue). What's worse is that illnesses such as Endo can be accompanied by other illnesses, too (e.g. Fibromyalgia, M.E., Post Viral Fatigue Syndrome, Lupus, Chronic Sinusitis). These illnesses can also lead to WEIGHT GAIN, either because they make a person more fatigued and in pain (causing a desire to exercise less), or because they lead to increased infections (which simply make a person feel really ill, and reduce activity that way).

Personally, I think that it is very unfair - maybe even PREJUDICIAL - to judge women with GYnae problems by their BMI, and to only allow women under a certain BMI to have IVF. My reasons are as follows:

1. Gynae illnesses can cause weight gain themselves, so the weight gain experienced is NOT the woman's fault. Therefore, if you penalise her for her BMI, you penalise her for something she had no control over.

2. Treatments (e.g. the Pill, Mirena, Zoladex, Prostrap) can cause weight gain as a side-effect. Once more, a woman with something like Endo, or Polycystic Ovaries, has no control over this. She is advised, and sometimes made, to take such treatment by her Doctor(s). She has no choice. Any weight gain caused by treatment is NOT the woman's fault. So, if you penalise her for her BMI, you penalise her for something she is not to blame for.

3. There are obese and even morbidly obese women whose excess weight IS caused by things that are TOTALLY THEIR FAULT (such as overeating). Women like these are able to get pregnant, and NOBODY is constantly monitoring THEIR weight or BMI. This is a "slap in the face" to women with Gynae problems, because it demonstrates just how cruel the BMI rule is. If a woman who is overweight/obese due to her own irresponsibility (overeating, "couch potato") IS allowed to have kids, then why should a woman whose weight gain is caused by an illness or by medication be punished by being PREVENTED from having kids?

Now, I understand that Gynaecologists may argue that being obese/morbidly obese makes the risks during pregnancy much greater - however, as I have clearly demonstrated, there are plenty of women out there who care nothing for such risks - they overeat, they are obese and they still get pregnant (and many go on to have perfectly healthy babies).

To return to my story, at the start of my problems my BMI was somewhere around 25. I wish that somebody, ANYBODY, had sat me down and explained fully about fertility and IVF then. I wish that the monitoring of BMI had been explained to me. I wish that I had been clearly told that women over a certain BMI, and AGE, would be refused IVF. Instead I WAS TOLD NOTHING!

When my inability to conceive first came to light, I was 31, and about 91/2 stones. Over the years, and in my desperation to relieve my pain and fatigue and other symptoms, I have accepted treatments that have actually messed with my fertility. NOBODY fully explained this. Over the same years, I have put weight on, so that now, I have to watch my BMI carefully. I blame my weight gain on the treatments I have taken, as well as on the fact that I am now less active due to chronic pain and fatigue (I used to do aerobics and go hillwalking - I can't any more). Sadly, I am also now 43 years old, and in my home town, the cut off point for IVF is 38 years old. NOBODY EVER TOLD ME THAT!!

I have had to find EVERYTHING out the hard way. I am now under the care of a very competent Gynaecologist - a polite, pleasant man who tries to give me as much advice, information and support as possible. It is HE who has had to break the news about my fertility (because of the number of surgeries I have had both conception and pregnancy would be a huge risk). HE has also informed me of the rules about age and BMI - much to my distress.

All I can advise you is NOT TO GIVE UP. I can tell you DO NOT EVER LET ANYONE PLACE YOU IN THE POSITION THAT I (AND MY POOR HUSBAND) ARE NOW IN. If you desire to have children, do all you can to achieve it. If I could turn the clock back, believe me, I WOULD! Your wife is at the age I was when I started the "journey", but unlike me, she is more "clued up". That's the best part of it - there IS information out there, and things that may help you, you just have to look for them. The Internet can be a good "friend"!

Perhaps you have to accept that the Medical Profession WILL continue to bully your wife about her BMI? Now, this is wrong, but they ARE very rigid about rules. So, you have to get with that. Weight loss is perhaps the only answer.

If your wife does try to lose weight, please support her as much as you possibly can. When couples diet and exercise together, the success rate is far higher. People are motivated by the support of others. Try to eat the same meals, try to get some exercise together. Find things you both enjoy doing. Take it slowly - do not expect a "quick fix". "Yoyo" dieting is not healthy; it is better to lose weight slowly and steadily, and keep it off.

Perhaps your wife could try a slimming club like "Weight Watchers"? Or she could try the Endometriosis Diet, which is a special eating plan recommended especially for women with Endo. In the meantime, explain to your Doctor(s) just how upset your wife is by everything - explain that she feels under pressure to lose weight because of the BMI rules. It is prudent to explain this to your Doctor(s) because weight loss is not always easy, and if your wife becomes stressed or depressed about her weight, and the refusal of IVF until she is thinner, she may actually gain even more weight. Sadly, stress and depression can lead to "comfort eating" - that is why YOUR support is so important.

I really DO hope that you can sort something out. Encourage your wife as much as you can. Praise her for any weight loss - even a tiny amount. The more she grows to like the praise, the more she may stick at her diet and exercise. Keep her motivated by reminding her of your joint goal (having IVF). Also, motivate her by letting her know of any added benefits of weight loss - she will be fitter and more active, so if she does eventually become pregnant, she will be able to do more with her child.

DO try to ensure that your wife does NOT get carried away by "fads", "gimmicks" and "quick fixes". Many are dangerous cons, and things like Diet Pills can be very risky - some have been found to contain AMPHETAMINE (speed!), and there have even been deaths as a result. Also, remember that surgery is also hugely risky. Things like Liposuction and Gastric Bands may seem appealing, as the clinics advertising such procedures often promise the earth. The truth is that many people put weight on again after these surgeries, as they do not change their eating and exercise habits. Also, the surgeries themselves carry risks - anaesthetic, scarring, complications.

Do what you consider to be sensible and natural, to encourage a healthy weight loss. Enlist as much support for your wife as is possible. And DO NOT GIVE UP. If you really want something, sometimes in life you must really work hard to have it!

Wishing you all the very best,

Elaine Ellis.

P.S. I still think the BMI thing is wrong, and cruel! Here are some links to information for you:

1. The Endometriosis Diet - endo-resolved.com/diet.html

2. Weight Watchers - weightwatchers.co.uk

3. Slimming World - slimmingworld.com/

4. Hormone Imbalance (Oestrogen Dominance) and Weight Gain -

ion.ac.uk/information/onarc...

and

hormonalharmony.co.uk/why-you-may-be-oestrogen-dominant/

5. BMI and IVF (it's an American article, but it explains things pretty well) -

univfy.com/fertilitychronic...

6. A really useful website/forum - fertilityfriends.co.uk (I have seen posts on this forum from ladies with BMI well over 30 who HAVE been given IVF - so you could say that this suggests that some NHS regions relax the rules!).

[chipie in reply to Scooteeder]

Thanks for a nice message, and has made me inspired to do more and help the wife out. You are an amazing woman and i thank you for your nice words and wise thoughts. keep in touch and hope to hear from you soon. x

[Sarahlf]

Unfortunately my weight never stayed under 30 but that was after the second round of ivf worked. I did lighter life to loose the weight and did this in 5mths! I was also 39 when I conceived and 40 when I gave birth so miracle do happen x

[chipie in reply to Sarahlf]

Thats nice to hear and i hope it works out for my wife too, thanks for the inspiration. x

[chipie]

wow, thank you very much for taking time to write back to me, much appreciated, your message did bring me strength and happiness as well as saddness and regret that what you have had to go through, i really feel for you and your husband and wish that the future brings you happiness and success in starting a family as you have been misled and told wrong information all through the important years of your life, just like to say i am sorry to hear what you have had to go through and wish that out of all this some happiness comes as you both deserve it.

We went to the clinic for our first appointment so dont even know why we can't conceive, but the test they did show that we are ok in terms of eggs and sperms, they just turned us away and said she needs to get to the BMI level as they cant go further which i think is not fair.

But my wife is determined to lose weight and has started running on the threadmill and we are changing out eating habbits and see what happens. But we are both getting stress from our families as in asian cultures we have been married over 6 years with no kids and people start talking.

Ty for your time to reply back and il speak to you in a bit as i have just started work and give me time to read your mail and gather my thoughts. Take care and have a nice weekend.

[Scooteeder]

Hi again Chipie (and wife),

Thank you for your kind response. I'm delighted to hear that you and your wife are already starting to make the effort to get fitter and healthier - and that your wife is running on the treadmill to lose weight. Blimey! I doubt that I could manage that kind of exercise! Half an hour's gentle aerobics is more than enough to utterly wear me out! I think the older I've got, the more unfit I've got... it's VERY easy to become set in our ways. I reckon that because I've never really put lots of weight on in the past, it's very easy to take for granted that this will NEVER happen. The truth is that even women like me, who don't put lots of weight on easily, can still become VERY unfit of we don't exercise. I bet that there are women who are bigger than me, who are actually FITTER, and can do more exercise! Exercise takes commitment, and it's far too easy to get out of practice.

Like I said, encourage your wife as much as you possibly can - and join in, too - exercising together can be motivational. It makes something that can seem like a chore for one person into something that is more of a fun joint activity. If you are both quite competitive people, you could even score each other on how long you can work on the treadmill, or how many sit ups you can do - things like that can up the ante, and get you exercising even more. Do remember to start off gently, though!

And, as to the pressure from relatives to start a family... I do understand that this is NOT an easy thing to deal with. I have experienced similar pressure off my husband's family in the past (and they are Born Again Christians!). It's sad, but true, that no matter what your religion or cultural background, MANY people face pressure from their families, and especially parents, to produce grandchildren once they are married. I think people just take it for granted that married couples have kids! People DO NOT expect that infertility/fertility problems may get in the way - simply because people generally do not go about expecting the worst all the time!

I totally understand that it is not easy to cope with things when people about you do not fully understand, or give support. Still, you and your wife clearly have a strong relationship, and seem intent on sticking together no matter what. Truth be told, children or no children, THAT is the sign of a loving couple - and a very good start. If you can cope together with this, then you can cope together with most things (including raising children if and when you have them).

Stick at it - good luck.

Best wishes,

Elaine Ellis.

P.S. Another link to some more words of assistance:

How to tell family and friends about fertility problems -

resolve.org>Support and Services>Talking About Infertility

[chipie]

Hello Elaine Ellis,

Thank you for another reply that was really warming and encouraging, its much appreciated and you have said good things and have given me good links to sites i wouldnt have known, and its really hard to find honest people like you, thanks for your help and i hope i can too be of help to you in the future if you need anyone to talk to as you are very mature and wise. Wish you the best and hope we can chat again soon.

I hope all is well with you and you too have success in producing a big family, because god above has given us all a gift of reproducing and sooner or later we will get our luck that we deserve. My work collegue is in his 60's and is expecting his second child next month so there is hope for all of us. Speak soon and hope u have a nice weekend.

Regards Arfan

[Lisa-Jane]

Hi,

I have also am in this situation. My partner and I went for our first appointment in October where we learnt that my partner had a pretty much zero sperm count (has since improved) and were told our only option is ivf. However we couldn't have ivf as my BMI was 38. At that meeting I was given 3 months to get my BMI down to under 30. I remember thinking "oh my god I'm never going to loose that" I knew I could loose some in that time as I had already lost 2 and a bit stone before our appointment.however I thought I would give it a bash!! My partner is a personal trainer so I knew as soon as we left that appointment I knew my life would not be mine again!!!!! he's like a Sargent major.. Christmas was a totally wipe out and I think I managed to eat one quality street, and that was only because my partners family felt bad for me and "forced me"

I've ran on the treadmill and swam every day and Then did circuit training and weight training 3times a week..I was totally knackered constantly.. But did see the weight dropping.

My appointment was 2weeks ago and I had only managed to get my BMI down to 34, which my consultant said was great but keep going. I now have 3months again to get my BMI down to under 30 he did say at 29 he might consider thinking about my op (found out I now have cysts) but who knows.. I just hope I can get it down as I have stopped the circuit training now and weights.. As I was just getting too tired and grouchy, and overly emotional!!!

My friend had ivf about 4 years ago mad never had this BMI problem despite hers being over 40 they did ask her to loose weight and I think she lost a little. So I can only presume this is a relatively newish thing...

Whilst I understand why they do want your BMI under 28 but it doesn't stop me thinking it's quite unfair. However such is life and these are the things we have to do..

The only way to get round it is going private.. But like you said your wife has a treadmill and she's determined to loose the weight I'm sure she will.. The treadmill works wonders even if it's just an hour day .. I've not done weightwatchers or anything like that I've just cut out the crap I was eating.. Drink plenty of water and I live on fresh fruit smoothies.

I think everyone's weightloss journey is very different and personal and the fact my partner has been supportive has made a huge difference to me cos up till then my "get up and go , had got up and gone."!!! The fact you are prepared to support your wife and help her will make her journey easier is fantastic..It also has helped me coming on this site as I have been able to talk to others going through similar situations... Not just regarding weightloss but the whole process of infertility and ivf and what to expect...

I wish you both the best of luck.

[chipie in reply to Lisa-Jane]

Hi Lisa, thanks for taking the time to reply back, hope your having a nice weekend and was really nice to read your message. I am so happy for you as i know it must be hard talking about this subject as no likes to be told negative things and for you to be strong and determined takes alot of strength and courage. I hope you get to your goal too and never give up You have done the hardest part and you are so close to the end of the tunnel and god willing it will all be worth it. Thanks for giving me the strength and courage too, helping my wife and making us strong. Good luck and best wishes and hope to speak soon. Regards Arfan

[LHow81]

I have to agree with an earlier post BMI is a waste of time I lost 50kg a few years ago with weight watchers but put around 20kg back on and had to lose it again for the IVF I managed it with the knowledge left to me via weight watchers and the exercise bike is my friend! I am really worried at gaining any again as I am only just under. Hoping it all goes well with you and good luck on the weight loss for her.

[chipie in reply to LHow81]

hi, thanks for reply, and really good to hear that you done well and i hope you keep up the good work. hopefully fingers crossed we can achieve it too but what was dissapointing was that on the first appointment we had done our tests and were both fine but they didnt do further test as to why we can't conceive, they litterally turned us away and said come back when she hits this magic number of 30 BMI. Hope all is going well with you and good luck and best wishes for the future. Regards Arfan

[manfamuppet]

It is hard to lose weight I for one can aporeciate that. I had a BMI of 53 and I had the daunting rask of losing over 7 stone, but what kicked me into gear was my specialist telling me I was wasting his time because I needed to lose weight before they would help me.

That spurred me on to prove a point I could do it and I did! It took me 3 years through weightwatchers and although it seems a long time I had to lose over 7 stone!!! Losing weight can be done but it is extremely hard and testing at times but if you keep afocus of a baby in the forefront of your mind whilst on a weight loss journey it all helps.

Goid luck with your weight loss and having a baby.

[chipie in reply to manfamuppet]

Thanks for your message of support and i am happy to hear that you were successful and wish u all the best for the future. Sorry to hear that it took you that long but as long as you got to your target that what matters and i hope my wife gets to her target. Thanks once again and good luck to you.

[kidofthe80s]

Hello, I am new here *waves hi to everyone!* I am in the exact same predicament as your wife. We had our initial consultation yesterday, and was told in a nutshell no treatment until I have a BMI of 29, currently stands at 39. Following this the consultant continued to hand sheets or papers for bloods and scans, and I'm currently thinking what is the point. I suffer from endometriosis, and as soon as puberty hit I gained my weight, I was actually a very skinny child!! I have never been offered any help toward my weight, (I have been in and out of the hospital that is currently dealing with us, from about 15, due to gynaecological issues, and not one note or record was in that room) and as I sat in the room yesterday it was just a bit of a blur, and I know it was a clinic, but it was so clinical the way in which I was handled, more of a go through checklist and tick boxes approach, rather than a human one. Sorry my first post has turned into a bit of a moan. It's nice to know I'm not alone. x

[LHow81 in reply to kidofthe80s]

Hiya kid, sorry to hear you clinic wasn't as helpful or as kind as they could have been. I would look at ways of losing weight there is a chance I know you think there is no point but I'm sure you can. Also if you're able to pay for it I am not sure they're so strict on weight. It's hard the BMI thing I don't really believe in it myself. I have found though once I got to the weight they wanted me too they never weighed me again. Try to keep your chin up and stay positive x

[kidofthe80s in reply to LHow81]

Hi, thanks for the message of support Well I've picked myself up and dusted myself down. I think I was just in a mega grump when I posted that last message, but it had been an overwhelming day. Healthy eating and more exercise is the way forward, try and lose some for my next appointment and see what happens from there. xx

[Sunnysarah01]

Hiya

I'm in the same boat as I knew I was goin for IVF I was trying desp to lose the weight before my referral however at my referral appointment my BMI was 31 (only 1 over) and they still wouldn't refer me

[kidofthe80s in reply to Sunnysarah01]

It's just pants!! xx

[Shell_78]

My bmi was 30.4 and they wouldn't let me go ahead with it even though prior to that I'd got to a bmi of 29 but had an operation to remove a cyst, so obviously put on weight post op. Really struggled since then with my weight, I've tried diet chef, 30day shred, couch to 5k, low carb, low sugar, nothing seems to work I have another appointment in 6 days and I'm at 31 bmi, other than starving myself I'm accepting that it'll be another no! It's so depressing PCo's makes weight loss so hard!