God knows I've tried; lesbians, gays, and religion

Two You tube videos. One a beautiful song "God know's I've tried", from a "big name" in religious music, Ray Bolts who came out around 3 years ago

The other showing complete disgust for this "coming out" . (You just have to highlight the link then right click "go to......" )Here's the links.

Gemma XX

Oh yes relevance to this site, I believe the pressure of being "different" and trying to pretend all your life that you are someone you are not does lead to a lot of suicides in LGBT people even in this country. There is a huge amount of fear of coming out and often it does not feel possible to be a religious person and be gay and yet Jesus and God said "come as you are".

I really wanted to ask at the service today if "coming as you are" would include lesbians and gays but I didn't as I thought I would get thrown out of the church. I have people who know me but if they knew that about me they would probably hate me; it's crazy but a major stressor for many LGBT people.

Gemma X

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13 Replies

  • It's a shame that you should have friends who don't know that you're a lesbian Gemma. It's a shame that we live in world where it should make any difference. I try to raise my children to understand and believe that you'll love who you love because of the person that they are, regardless of their gender. And just when I think it makes sense to them, something will come on the radio about a gay footballer who has just 'come out'. Why on earth should that ever make headline news? What would people say if they switched on the TV to news that 'Famous male football player admits heterosexuality. Seen last night in a pub with a girl' Surely in this day and age a person's sexuality shouldn't be of interest to anyone! X

  • I agree with Lucy that anyone's sexuality is their own business.

    Gemma it matters not a hoot and you should never feel guilty

    About this.

    Maybe your friends would understand this, and really if they don't

    Accept you as you are then I would be crossing them off my friends


    Hugs to you

    Hannah xx

  • Thank you Lucy and Hannah. My situation is very much complicated by the fact I constantly wonder whether my emotional attachment to women is because of the faulty "attachment bond" i had with my mum and therefore that with therapy it can change .

    It is interesting that in the "borderline" therapy group I was in half the participants were lesbians.

    I don't think that is the reason why everyone is gay but it could be the reason why I am like I am and the fact that I sort of agree with so much of what my mum told me ; that men are intrinsically able to overpower and I don't want to be a second class citizen so avoiding that sort of contact with men means they can't actually control or dominate me in a personal way. This would hurt me and hurts me even now seeing how men can overpower in the world and the sex act for me with a man is the embodiment of being overpowered and I just don't know how strong women can stand it or want it (hopefully that isn't too graphic) ; but at the same time I like some of the qualities that men have like the protectiveness but I guess you can't have the one without the other?

    Also with women I go off sex after a few weeks after having a very ambiguous relationship with it in the first place. I think I am looking for security and as soon as I can "get away with it" I drop the sex and go for the routine and the comfort; they then get fed up with me (but men would get fed up a lot quicker I think) and after a few weeks/months/years they leave. I did live with someone for couple of years with no sex after those first few weeks but she did leave eventually. I would say that all the "relationships" I have had have been up to now messed up and immature and coloured by my background so its difficult to know what is a real thing and what is because I've been messed up by my mum.

    I did actually mean what i posted the other day about agreeing with marriage bonds and so forth; socially I am very heterosexual ( I am feminine and just like everyone else) and I just want to fit in and don't want to be different. So it's difficult.

    I hope no-one feels I've been lying on here? I am still trying to find myself and wish to God to be honest that I could have a lovely relationship with a man as being different singles me out which I don't want.

    Posted up as well because I know that LGBT people have a higher incidence of mental health problems than the general population and there is very little on healthunlocked about this. I am thinking if someone comes on and types it into a search they will find very little. At least seeing my post they will realise there are others like them which sort of reduces the stress. I do feel there will be people who are reading who would never dare come out and that is fine and there is every reason not to ; however this is a relatively safe place as I don't have to face the day to day reactions to it like I would in real life.

    Going out in a bit to a place where no-one knows and I can keep up my "good" impression.

    Gemma X

  • Hi Gemma

    I guess you will be able to predict what I think about your feelings of being gay. I think you say it all when you say about going off sex once you are in an established relationship and really just wanting the routine and comfort. I think you are looking for the mothering you did not get. In that situation it is only natural that you will turn to women and not be drawn to desiring sex with men. You do not say whether you actually desire sex with women in the first place - whether you have sexual fantasies that are lesbian - or whether you get involved and then your desire becomes linked to the person you are with and that's why you have sex with women. It is so subtle and difficult to know. I missed out on the kind of close mothering, as you know, and am definitely drawn to women for emotional closeness. I can explore fantasies of sex with either gender but have never wanted actual sex with women. I think that is because I am in touch with my emotional need for the mothering I missed out on. When women know ABOUT their childhood (think about it) but do not feel the need and grief for maternal care then they feel they are gay - because we all have sexual needs and they will attach to those people we need from emotionally. Sexual needs are not in themselves about WHO - they are just physical desires that need satisfying - whereas WHO those needs become attached to is psychological and that's about emotional development.

    I'm not sure whether that makes sense to you?


  • Hello Sue, no, one thing about you, I am not able to predict what you will say!

    Yes i think I sort of agree with what you are saying in relation to myself although I am sure that some women are genuinely gay and that is more a question for many of them having some element of masculinity within them (this is just my opinion folks if anyone is reading).

    For me I think it is more likely related to my emotional development and my mum. However reading your response I feel mad that I try so hard to develop and it also makes me feel angry to those who I see as developed like yourself as they have power as they are in the right and I can't deny it but I sort of hate that diminishment of me in that as I would like to feel like that too.

    I always appreciate your responses. I must admit sometimes I feel resentment and jealousy as I do think you have got a lot of the answers and I don't; you're not in the position i am in right now and I wish I was not in this position. I know you always encourage honesty Sue so hope you take those particular comment in the way they are meant; just as an exploratory thing for me.

    I'm having a very bad day today. Feeling sorry for myself but will post up about it seperately. It's all connected I guess to this and to the low i feel inside but it is all exaggerated by lack of sleep and the holiday period i guess. I really do try my best and I just want everyone to know that.

    Gemmalouise X

  • Gemma

    I hope you know that I am certainly not always in the right! I just give my own understanding, many people will not agree with me because what I say can only ever be one point of view. I follow the biological idea that we are here to procreate and nothing more, survival of the genes, and that anything else is affected by our being human and therefore always contains a psychological component. That's not a fact, there are experts who debate the idea for a living :)

    It is hard to want answers, because really there are none. You are as you are, we all have to come to terms with being who we are and finding a path in life that is right for ourselves and it's often painful facing things we wish were different - I have spent much of my life feeling that kind of pain as you know.

    Have a cuddle from me and try to find a way to really enjoy Christmas. In recent years I have realised just how short life is, so enjoy what you have as best you can.


  • Homophobia what a joke, honestly it's straight out of the dark ages! They say in ancient Greece it was actually the norm to be gay...fast forward a few centuries and Oscar Wilde is locked up for being one, the worlds gone mad.

    You know what I think its got nothing to do with being gay or the sexual preference, its man's need to find fault and if you are in annnnyway different bingo we can look down on you. truely pathetic.

    There are Roman vases with men in flagrante delicto, primitive African carvings.

    Did you hear the News Quiz the other day sooo funny and they were saying how ridiculous that something like 70 years after women got the vote, we now have the 1st female bishop...bonkers.

    Thing is Gemma people can only cope with what they can cope with, so if some of your congregation dont approve you just have to pity them their ignorance, through their own prejudice they rob themselves of part of the life experience, embracing peoples uniqueness.

    And lets face it, it is purely peoples uniqueness that has propelled man kind, allowed us to evolve. If we were all the same we would have died out years ago!

    Celebrate yours or anyone elses uniqueness it is where our salvation if you like really resides.

    Besides whose funnier than gays right....just pulling you leg. It is the stereotype though :-)


  • Hi Gemma,

    I just think that people should just let other people to live their lives the way they want, obviously not going against the law, but within the law.

    I was taught never to judge someone on the colour of their skin, any disabilities, faith/religion, sexuality etc. And I stand by that I designed a t'shirt and one of the quotes on the back say 'don't judge a book by it's colour'

    I think if more adults was more accepting of people like children are then this world would be a much better place to live in, I went visiting family on friday til saturday and I saw my 3 young cousins, a 2 month old, a 2 year old and a 5 year old, and I told the oldest 2 that I had a poorly ear and they didn't ask why or what's wrong, they just accepted the fact and when they spoke to me they spoke to my good ear, I think that more people should watch other children not judging and copy them and not judge anyone, and just accept people for who they are.

    I hope your ok and you have friends that accept you the way you are.

    Take care,

    Siobhan x

  • Siobah what a lovely and thoughtful message and thank you for writing it. I am glad your family are growing up not to be judgemental and to accept others; just wish the whole world was the same .

    I was really touched by your very kind reply, so thank you for this and hope you are managing reasonably well at the moment. XX

  • I'm glad that message made sense was worried it wouldn't to be honest. :)

    I'm doing pretty well, still got the effects of a concussion from last thursday but I'm actually doing pretty well, thank you for asking, I hope your well at the moment, and that saying is don't judge a book by it's cover, wrote colour by mistake stupid brain at it again.

    Take care Gemma,

    Siobhan xx

  • Hello Gemma

    You always seem to have a sad complicated life that can cause problems in different ways. Your family, with the exception of a Sister and Father seems lacking now and people in Middle Age need to fulfill their life choices as best they can. An old saying comes to mind

    If you have a itch, scratch it, comes to mind.

    Remember your happiness is more important and if you hurt yourself that is your decision and you will live with those consequences. Other peoples thoughts do not matter, all is your decision.

    As long as you are happy and do not hurt, both ways

    Good Luck


  • Thanks for this Bob. Yes you are right, I do overthink and yes many times my life does feel sad and complicated. I feel a litte better and clearer today having got those things sorted regarding the TV and also yes I think it is weird to what ridiculous extent I worry about what other's think because at the end of the day I should not be living my life to please or fit in with what i think the world wants but it is easier said than done as no-one likes to be ostracised I guess.

    But you are right; I don't have a family to speak of and i know if I don't make some sort of a go of it now then it really will be even more serious once dad has gone; I do "keep trying" as my name suggests and will continue to do so.

    I also believe to a certain extent in God and fate. Today I decided to tidy up some of the rubbish in my road which had flown out of boxes which were left out for bin collection. A man from two doors down was just drawing up in his van and he asked if I wanted a "litter grabber" * (Is it called?). I have never used one before and could not believe his kindness and interest he was taking.

    I don't know if it's the Christmas spirit but it felt like my world is expanding and the litter grabber really made light work of the task. I do feel I am learning things slowly. He said when he is back at work he will order me one and leave it somewhere for me.

    It doesn't matter if he actually does; it was just so nice a thought; so many good things happened today after yesterdays real desperate low. I keep praying that God will give me the strength to develop as much as i need to to carry on and I keep getting answers ( little angels, like that thing that happened today)

    This forum as well is complete lifesaver for me. I have never felt so welcome anywhere or understood in the way I am here ; no-one outside of here will ever listen to one tenth of the sort of things I say on here and I am being myself on here, which is good. XX

  • Gemma

    Remember we all need to be comfortable in our own skin, This helps us live our lives in a more positive light.