Im new here and have a question concerning liver..My husband has been very ill over the years, last year he was so il we thought we were going to loose him. This year he is looking healthy (looking not is). His drs kept telling him his liver,kidneys,heart, everything is good. but what they are saying and what is happening to him are different, ill explain.Hes been an alcoholic for many many years,a heavy smoker for the same amount of time. The dr told him that he had cancer of the lungs and when he went to the hospital they told him its not cancer his lung has turned in on itself and they dont understand why. When he drinks now he has terrible pains in his stomach and heart burn and is violently sick (some times theres blood in there sometimes not), hes had diorreah for many years. So then he will go to bed for 24 hours and the get up tired, have a really bad chest and then go back to bed and sleep more, then he will get up have a few drinks and be fine, he will drink the next day and the cycle of being sick,heartburn, bad chest starts again..
Now he had a print out of his health in the last 10 years from the dr and in 2009 states he has cirrhosis, so he confronted his dr about it because the dr had told him that his liver was ok,and the dr said thats what the concultant was looking for so she put cirrhosis. and then the dr went onto tell him that he is looking healthy. I spoke to a friend whos husband died of it and she said he is showing all the signs of liver failure. I personally dont trust drs as i have known personally two men who have died through failure of drs.. Now the problem is he listens to the drs but the other day he said his liver is f.....ked..but im not sure if he is going on how he is feeling or if he is seeing what the drs put on the report as real.
My question is has anyone else had simular expeienced with drs and within themselves.
Thanx for reading..
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lyn3
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I didn’t bother to go to the drs but being violently ill is something I did about 3 or 4 years before my transplant. Also a very chesty cough and being exhausted are another things I suffered from. I suggest he stop drinking and ask his gp for a blood test and if that looks border line he asks for a fibroscan. I’m sorry to say he sounds pretty ill.
Thank you isabelle,,,Hes been to the drs loads and they do blood tests and they come back to everything being normal, so because they come back normal he thinks its because his ulcer is the reason he is feeling the way he is...
Are the doctors aware of his alcohol consumption? That's what will be causing most of his symptoms. It is possible to have normal blood results but still have cirrhosis which can be fatal without a huge change in life style, diet and proper medication. In your husbands case, he needs more than just blood tests to reveal a true diagnosis and sooner rather than later.
Hi Laura..Yeah they are , in fact when he used to say oh i only drink half ltr of vodka a day and a couple of cans i will say um tell the truth ,its a ltr of vodka a day and 8 cans, the dr replied its ok when ever a paitient tells us what they drink we add a third ontop because an alcoholic always lies about how much they drink, so now when i go in and they ask they know im honest with them. Yeah i agree with you bloods is not enough in his case and the most they have done is the scan on his liver, i said to the woman doing the scan when she says normal , im like are you sure your looking at the right screen? i was in the room when she done the scan so none of what is said is just from his mouth, i make sure i go in all the consultations, in fact he insists i go in there with him.Problem is when he sees consultants, wether it be liver or lungs and they say all is fine and discharge him, then he thinks as i said its his ulcer playing up. When he confronted the dr about what he seen on paper saying he had cirrhosis ,saying it states on here i have cirrhosis but you told me two weeks ago my liver was normal ,the dr replied oh its on that paper ( his health print out) because thats what the hospital put because they were quirying it. i looked at the dr and said why would they put quiry on his medical report, and he shrugged his shoulders and said i dont know but his liver is fine. and then went onto say and to be honest i proberly shouldnt say this but you (meaning husband ) are looking well, i said to the dr you are right you shouldnt say it. and he smiled, so of course when we walked out of the room he said see everything is fine even the dr stated i looked well, i said what you look and the signs and two different things.I have suggested he changes drs but he says i been with them since being born.
Yes a change of doc sounds like a very good idea to me. Hubby is happy to stick with the same 1 because he is saying all the things hubby wants to hear. X
your right he is sticking to that one because they are saying what he wants to hear, the other reason i think is because he dont want to hear the truth if he is seen by other drs, the thing is he has lost alot of friends through drink etc and think he thinks if he hears the words you are dieing he will just drink more. He was told in the hospital when he was in for a bad chest infection that should he continue drinking he will be dead by the time he is 50, and that dr died 6 months later from rare blood cancer, and now husband is past 50 he says see the dr who said that to me is dead and im still here past 50..So no reasoning with him..He will never go to another dr,, i have myself gone in on an appointment to talk to the drs with my concerns and they say we have alot of concerned relatives coming in to talk about their concerns with drink and they say well unless he comes in and talks with us about his concerns our hands are tied, so i said cant you just call him in for a routine check, the reply was he needs to make that choice himself, i said so in other words because he is an alcoholic you dont want to help him, the dr smiled and that was it. One dr told me off for calling him out because he was constantly being sick and bringing up blood , hubby said he was fine and the dr could clearly see he wasnt, so the dr said so why did she ring me, i said that she has a name, he said dont call me out if he will say he is fine, your waisting mine and his time. I shouted at the dr to leave and reported him. I said its bad enough having to care for him with out the dr giving me greif to.
Totally agree laura that they tell him to give up drink and smoking and yet not give the right diagnosis, why say give up when all tests are normal? its like they dont care. I talked to a friend about this because she lost her husband a few years ago and she had the same problem, the only way they told him that he had cirrhosis was when he was in intensive care, she said why wasnt he told sooner so he wouldnt be in this place maybe, their response was we cant help those who wont help themselves, she said he might have given up the drink had he been told he had it. He came out of intensive care after 3 weeks and stopped drinking, but his mum died and he went back on the booze, every time he went into hospital they would treat him like he was dirt , the only time they was understanding was when he was in the last stages of dieing. Same drs by the way.
We are in South Wales Uk. Yeah ill make an appointment with just me going in and il have a chat with them and let them know whats been said here.Thanx..
Thank you all for reading and answering, means alot to know others understand.
Good on you. You just have to keep trying unfortunately. But it must be - well I can tell it is - so hard when someone is so stubborn. I was stubborn until a a Consultant said stop or else but even that hasn’t worked with your hubby.
Not sure if you said but does he get HE? If he does wait until he’s “out of it” and ring 999. If Consultants see him in that state when he’s still out then you MAY get a different response.
Hi, thanx for your reply..Yeah he gets HE..done that been there with the consultants..They have it on record of how things have been so they always go on that..:)..
That is one of the biggest problems with alcoholics... they wont admit they have a drink problem and until they do, docs wont and cant treat them ... whats the point ? They could offer help, treatments and councelling but if they carry on drinking the nhs resources are wasted when it could be used far more wisely on someone who says " help me , I'm an addict, its making me ill, I want to quit and recover". Your hubby HAS to admit it and until he does, you are tieing yourself up in knots and banging you head on a brick wall trying to make him see sense. If he wont ask for help theres NOTHING more you can do. So its vitally important you look after yourself now, you almost have to become as selfish and stubborn as he us being. Believe me Lyn, I know I've been there. If he carries on as he is he may reach 54 if he's lucky, thats only as far as mine got ! 💔
He is obviously self medicating, i.e.
Drinking to ease and block out the pain of losing his Mum which of course he's kidding himself is helping but it isn't. Alcohol is a depressant in itself so if he's already depressed, drink is only making that worse. So his mental state also needs addressing. But without him asking for help it won't happen, truly the doctors aren't to blame here, your hubby, no matter how unbearable it might be for him to admit, has to take control of the situation himself first.
Look after yourself Lyn, I can help you with that if needs be
Hi laura, Yeah he admits hes got a problem , he does one day off and one day on with drinking but as i said its still drinking. Its the results coming back normal i dont get as i have seen how ill he gets, hes got to the point a few times where his words are i thought i was dieing last night, and i scream at him well do something about it then, you have had warning after warning one day you wont be able to tell me you thought you were dieing because you will be dead just like all those friends of yours, and as all alcoholics the response is if its meant to be its meant to be..Oh i have become stuborn to him and have shown him tough love by choosing to move out , i wont turn my back on him because i still love him but maybe me not being around all the time might shock him into realising what he is loosing. Yeah i agree with you, he is 52 this year. Hes been drinking every day and smoking since he was 13. Yeap he used to go to school drunk. He self medicates with hemp meds bought off ebay. Hes also on other meds, including co codomol 30/500. He was assulted two years ago which gave him a bleed on the brain and almost killed him, so he cant comprehend some things thats why i go with him also to all his appointments because he can never remember what they say.. Oh im not blaming the drs for his health, the way he is , what i dont like is when they treat me like im a criminal or a drinker myself. I have wanted to see a diagnosis of some kind so either that will shake him up or will give me a better idea of how to deal with it, because when there is no diagnoses its harder than knowing there is. (oh the part about the mother i was refering to my friends husband then who died).. His parents are very much alive and he has no reason to be drinking other than addiction.
The dr who died once explained to me how someone becomes an alcoholic which was helpful, he said no one wakes up one morning and says think i will become an alcoholic today..He said everyone in some time of thier life as a teenager wil try drink, some dont like it and stay away from it, where as some enjoy it, they drink to impress thier mates or girls, they then start going to parties and get drunk, then at the age of 25 drinking starts to calm down and they drink one or two times aweek, and by the time they are 35 they only drink now and again , and by the time they are in their 50s the drink isnt a big part of thier lives, but alcolholics there is no drop, they start at a young age and continue usually until it makes them seriously ill or worse dead. I used to worry about hubby every day, every day i would nag him to get himself some help, used all sorts to make him feel bad and give it up , even the thought of dieing from lung cancer ( what the dr orginally told him he had) didnt cause him to try and make his last moments the best. Thank you once again for your support..
Have you seen Argyls post... Just sinking in ... took long enough? Many similarities, but took our advice and was in hospital the next day being treated and helped. We are all waiting for updates and hoping hes doing ok.
All the nagging from you wont help, i tried that too. But kicking him out and telling him you can come back when you're better worked. He went to his Mums, got 1 to 1 councelling and was dry for the last 3 months of his life. In that time i had him home at weekends to give his mum a break and so he could see what he could lose if he started drinking again. But as with your hubby he was drinking and in denial for too long.
Hi laura , yeah think his was the first one i read on here when i joined, when was the last time he posted? Yeah i stopped nagging along time ago ..Well its his house so im the one leaving as soon as im able to afford to get myself a place or here we have homes4u where we are given a priority wether its bronze,silver.gold,gold plus then you bid on the houses they have available.Which ever way im moving out.Its pretty sad to see so many lives destroyed not just the addicts but the ones like yourself left behind. When i left my first husband i was drinking loads, and then i realised how much damage drink does to the body and now i only drink soft drinks if i go in the pub which isnt often...
We havent heard from Argyl since he was admitted to hospital although he did send a private message to a couple of us. Left it that he'd be in touch when he can.
You know all the answers yourself Lyn ... they call it tough love. But you do have to look after yourself in the end for your own sanity. Hope you find a nice home for yourself, all the best darling. You know you can contact me whenever you like. Take care and dont ever at any point feel guilty either,
You said he admits he has a problem, but has anyone such as a GP ever said he has a drink problem or used the word alcoholic? I ask because when I finally sought help for drinking, a counsellor made an off the cuff comment, “Good luck with your recovery’.” It was quite a shock to hear such words from someone else.
I’m only a few years younger than your husband and am doing all sorts of things I wouldn’t/couldn’t do if I was drinking. He’s not old at all and will obviously look back with regret if he doesn’t change his ways. Can’t someone “in authority” such as his GP give him a telling off?
I feel very uneasy thinking I would have almost certainly become ill from drinking and put my wife through such an experience. Selfish in the extreme. For your sake and his, someone needs to have serious words. All the best to you both.
Hi Coco...They have not used the words drink problem or alcoholic (in front of me anyway and i go into all his appointments) they have said if you continue drinking we dont need to tell you but you will cause problems for yourself. The GPs tell him how good he is looking, tell him suprisingly your liver.kidney,lungs (apart from the damaged one) are all looking well so you must be doing something right, I have gone through so much with him from going back and forth to the hospital in ambulances, watching him being sick,cleaning it all up, being awake all night with him either being sick or having an herrendous cough, let alone all the things he says when he is drunk. To me he is a robot because he should have been dead along time ago, he was so ill at one stage that we didnt think he would make the wedding,but he did , then we didnt think he would make his bd in the dec but he did ,then we didnt think he would make the christmas but he did,because he was just skin and bone from not eating. On the outside he looks healthy, (infact all his friends tell him he does) . but all the symptoms tell other wise. It dont help when his freinds are asking him to go to magaluf for a week ,but he knows he wouldnt make it back home so hes being sensible and saying no. And they know how ill he gets. They once called me a nagging b, because when he was out with his friends he had been out for hours and i knew that meant drinking at least 8 pints, i rang him and said are you coming home? he said no so i went into the pub and said i wanted a word, he came home after the 9th pint and said that they had all said i was a nagging b and that if he was going to have any moaning off me to go back. So i marched into the pub when he fell asleep and shouted at them ,saying i maybe a nagging b but at least i care, i couldnt care less if he was like you lot able to drink and not be ill but i have to clean his mess up, watch him being sick and almost dieing on me, and be awake all night to make sure he doesnt choke on his own vomit, so the next time you want to open your gobs and start slagging me off remember im nagging him because i dont want him to die. and walked out. They all appologised the next day when they rang him. But they still insist on him going away with them.Whats worse is they have all watched other friends die as a result of alcohol. As i have stated concerning the drs one of my friends husband died recently due to them,the drs concerned have been to court over it. But they arent to blame for his drinking,illness, because he knows what its doing to him, but like all addictions its different for each person. Some can give it up,others try and succeed but go back on it. others find it hard to give up. But one thing i do notice with all alcoholics they are in denial of how much they really drink and are un aware of how much damage is really happening until its too late.My other friends husband had cirrhosis for 5 years and continued to drink and try to hide the cans and when she confronted him he said its only a couple of cans. He died of sepsis because the alcohol destroyed his immune system, and yes my husband is aware of this, i guess its like a its never going to happen to me syndrome.
It’s hard to explain. I probably didn’t drink as much as your husband, but as I knew I’d get health problems if I continued, I planned to stop “one day”. In the meantime, I carried on drinking. What I didn’t realise was how hard it would be to stop - that’s alcohol dependency which your husband clearly has. Looking back, I missed out on so much through drinking and should have stopped years ago.
At the moment, nothing’s working it seems for your husband. The GP’s going through the motions if he’s saying all is OK.
What does he care about? Would be stop if you moved out, for example?
Sadly coco he's gone beyond just alcohol addiction. As Lynne has said he is using alcohol to self medicate too which indicates an underlying mental issue which also needs addressing. But until he actually admits this to himself and doctors there's nothing that can be done for him. The first step in a recovery such as this has to come from himself. Its a vicious cycle he's in which only he can break before medical intervention can begin. It's dreadfully hard especially on Lynne, trying to make him come to his senses. The power of this bloody poison once you've hit rock bottom as he has makes quitting and recovery almost impossible for many. My admiration for Argyl is beyond words, he's made those first vital steps and look forward to hearing about his progress .
My heart goes out to you, both of you. What a very hard life it can be. You only can do what you think is right, and I think you are amazing, both of you actually, to be together even in these difficult circumstances. Take care of yourself lyn3, as kindly and patiently as you take care of your husband. Do what is best for you.
Hi220681..Thank you for your kind words..It is hard but i get through it every day with boldness...He has good days and bad days. He started to suffer with his legs caused through drinking (nerve damage) and the dr told him that if he continued drinking he would end up in a wheel chair. Then someone introduced him to CPT capsules and he takes them every day and his legs got better, but hes showing signs again of bad legs,swelling in his legs and ankles, and a lot of pain in his legs. So he will proberly double his dose on the capsules. It is very sad to see a young man walking and brain function like a man in his 90s, and very frustrating for me because its like having a child around me . I do shout at him and say its like having my 7 year old grandson with me all the time. I shout at him alot mainly out of frustration, because like all addicts he is demanding.But after 5 and half years its not such much easier, i just cope with it better. I guess with a child you cant just walk out for a few hours, but with an adult you can walk out for a few days, tee hee.
I do find it frustrating though when his freinds say to him ,oh you need to give it up mate your getting worse, your going to end up taking residency next to so and so in the cemetry and yet invite him away, or like yesterday one invite him out today to join him for a few drinks ,His reply was ,if im well enough mate because i have been in pain and ill all day today, and yet instead of saying ok mate lets leave it for another day ,they reply oh you will be ok tomorrow ill give you a bell.So i just let him get on with it. I used to lecture him on it but now he will say what you think? ill say if you want to go into an early grave be my guest,and then peace and quite because he sulks ha ha... smiles,today looks a bright and cheering day outside so im going to do what i do best,, shopping.:). Have a great day all what ever your doing..
Keep on keeping on. I admire you, your strength, your continued concern for your husband. I wonder if it would help you to visit your doctor and tell him about the impact on YOUR health and well being of living with your husband's very serious risk of death in the current circumstances, a risk that he, himself doesn't see at the moment? I can see how it doesn't work for you to ask the doctors about your husband - turn it on its head and see if that helps?
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I agree, I went to the docs in tears and completely exhausted, told my gp everything. She held my appointment open, sent me home to get hubby. I lied and told him they wanted to help with his depression, it was the only way he would agree to coming back with me.
The doc took 1 look at him, staggering and talking rubbish, fetched another doc and between them decided to get him into hospital to detox him and give me a much needed break.... it truely is hell !
Another thought.. if you do decide to see another doctor, might be worth making an appointment for yourself first so you can tell them everything youve told us and the truth about his alcohol consumption etc so that when you go to the neext appointment wuth hubby, he cant lie about anything and then hopefully get the treatment he really needs.
...also, with liver disease, we often get told we look well, especially when we feel really ill and toxic.
Personally no we have never had that kind of problem with doctors. My husband was an alcoholic for years. After having pains in his stomach for several days, he was admitted to hospital with pancreatitis. This happened twice. Year later ill again, detoxed in hospital and diagnosed with cirrhosis and told if you dont stop drinking you will die. He didnt stop until he finally admitted he MIGHT have a drink problem, got 1 to 1 councelling and was dry for 3 months, but died in intensive care of liver and kidney failure and bronco pneumonia, despite the amazing care he recieved from nhs staff to save him.
Sadly unless your husband is honest with himself and medical staff about how much he drinks and smokes, their treatment is limited and he could face the same fate.
I suggest you go with him to see the GP again asap explain his addiction problems thoroughly and ask for him to go to hospital to be detoxed with a view to councelling to assist him with giving up completely.
Its not going to be easy but its the first step to recovery.
I wish you both every success and please keep us posted.
Laura x
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Sounds a good plan of action to me Laura. Mote than good actually - essential I would say. No advice of course just my experience! I was lucky enough to not “look well” at the clinic once (about a year after diagnosis) and next minute - literally almost - I was in a hospital bed. Just in time from what happened next!
Hi laura thank you for your reply, The problem with him is he thinks because hes cut down loads which he has and his bloods keep coming back normal and his liver scan came back showing no signs of scaring than its not a problem. And as i stared he thinks its his ulcer playing up causing the pain and sickness. I have told him that drs arent always right and he says the evidence is there ie the blood results and scan. I go into every appointment with him so i know exatually what the dr ,consultants are saying and i am gob smacked every time,in fact i said im going to call him robot.When he went to see his liver consultant i said to her, how long does it take to get from fatty liver to cirrhosis if the person dosent give up drink and she said hes showing signs of it now, so ill book him in for a liver scan so i thought great now hes got a wake up call, he had the scan and she said its all looking normal and discharged him from her care. I know this isnt liver related but just to show what they say to him in the hospitals, he seen the liver consultant and she asked if he had seen his lung consultant yet? he said no next week i see her, so she replied well im not allowed to say what it is but there is something on the lung and all i can say its caused through smoking, you xrays look bad, so he attends the lung clinic, sends him to have another xray of his lungs and he then asks the guy doing it ,hows it looking mate? he said i cant say what it is but its looking worse than the last scan, so he goes into see the consultant and the first thing she says is right your xray results are looking good, so im going to discharge you. So when drs,consultants are saying his scans ,blood tests etc are all normal my hands are tied in him seeing how ill he really is. Hes got all the signs of cirrhosis ,fatigue,sickness,pains in his back,pains under his ribs, fluid in the ankles and legs, and a swollen belly, but still they say he is healthy..Im just glad i go in the drs/consultants office because i would think he was lieing. He got up yesterday afternoon after sleeping almost 24 hours and said he felt well and started drinking. Its a vicious circle.
Thanx again for taking the time to read, its nice to be able to share without being judged,family and friends go on at me and say if the drs tell him hes well dont go on at him drinking.So i dont tell them anything anymore. Ill keep you posted
Oh lyn bless your heart... he clearly is very poorly and you know that. I can not understand why he isnt in hospital, being detoxed, told he has to give up drinking and smoking and not being given a diagnosis of the lung scans. Where in the country are you? I think next appointment, take your phone with you, show them you are on this forum and the info we are giving you.
You shouldnt be fobbed off like this.
Good luck honey, keep us updated ok ? X
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Hi Laura
Your advice is brilliant. My heart goes out to you, you've been through so much. Love and hugs Lynne xxxx
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Thankyou Lynn. I only know what I know because I've had to go through it. If what I've experienced through my husbands life, addiction and illness , helps 1 person going through the same, then his death wasn't in vain xxx
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Hi
You are so caring. It must have been so very hard for you. Lots of hugs and love Lynne xxxx
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Thankyou Lynne. Same to you xxx
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You are very welcome and thank you. Love and hugs Lynne xxxx
That is awful! I go along with laura completely. It frustrated me like hell when a certain Consultant didn’t think a liver TP would do me any good. Then - thank goodness- a Consultant from QEHB came to the Royal Derby on one of his combined visits and said I’ll sort you out! And he did. I hate to think what would have happened if I hadn’t been at that joint clinic - well actually I do know what would have happened! ☁️☁️☁️
Well im glad that you were helped as you said you knew what would happen, happy you got caught just in time. So many people are dieing because of this stuff, they dont call it poison for the fun of it..
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Hi Milo
That's terrible that you could have ended up much worse if you hadn't seen that other consultant, it really goes to show that it all depends who you see on the day!! Everyone, please take care Lynne
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Hi Lynne - you are right for me in this case unfortunately! My trouble which probably made it very difficult for the Consultant was that I had other issues unrelated (?) to my old cirrhosis and I think he wasn’t sure that fixing one problem was enough? I don’t know but I really don’t like to be overly critical tbh. To me what mattered was the unfettered joy when the QEHB Consultant said come to Birmingham! It really was like winning the lottery. I think I won the lottery several times over,
- getting to go to QEHB
- getting on the Transplant List - THE List 👍
- getting an operation so quickly
- getting a superb liver - of course donor & family never to be forgotten!
Awe miles you, made me smile then, ty... So nice to hear appareciation, and yes what a blessing to be able to have all of the above....No you cant ask for much more i agree...:).
I really feel for and I hope that someone will finally listen to you!! As Laura said show them what has been said on here. Sending lots of love and hugs your way Lynne xxxx
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smiles,today looks a bright and cheering day outside so im going to do what i do best,, shopping.:). Have a great day all what ever your doing..
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