My friends may remember that in June 2021 I went to have a pacemaker inserted. During the procedure I suffered a pneumothorax which was not acted on for 3 hrs. In consequence I went into collapse and respiratory failure and my children were summoned because they gave me 10 mins to live. Due to my b....y mindedness and a cpap machine I survived. I began a formal complaint and have just received a 21 page report plus a 7 page letter from the consultant.
they have identified procedural issues which need correcting.
the nurse in charge told him when she realised I had collapsed but he ploughed on. They have made a recommendation that the consultant take notice of the concerns of the theatre nurse in future!
I had told him that I felt he punctured my lung and continued to tell him that I could not breathe because the lung had gone down. He ignored me.
He is trying to excuse the failure to act because he 'noted my distress' but put it down to breathlessness due my lung condition and 'elderly patients under sedation tend to move about a lot'.
How derogatory and prejudiced can you get!
Rather than admitting to a gross negligence by ignoring me he is attempting to use the presumption about 'elderly' lung patients to get himself off the hook.
There is a lot more to this obviously but it would take hours to read it.
They have now offered me the intimidatory option of meeting with the medical staff or of contacting the NHS Ombudsman.
I am waiting for my children to come back from their holidays to discuss the way forward.
In the meantime any ideas from anybody knowlegable on my next step?
I was just glad to be alive. Now I am steaming angry.
That patronising oaf should be struck off Littlepom and a discussion with the Ombudsman needs to happen. What a dreadful state of affairs. That man should not be allowed to operate on anyone and showed contempt for you and a complete lack of care. See what your family have to say. I’m spitting feathers!!!!
I don't blame you I think discussing with your fily is the best thing. Don't let him get away with what happened to you. Have a good night and take care 😊 Bernadette and Jack 🐕 xxxxxxx 🌻🌻
🤬🤬🤬 I would be spitting feathers as they say. However am not surprised by response. The consultant will have no doubt contacted his union and will I’m afraid been advised to not apologise or accept any liability. This tends to be usual response in negligence cases in case a patient decides to sue! The irony is that I believe in the vast majority of cases, a simple I’m sorry, I messed up would placate the situation and be an end to it. By insisting that they have done nothing wrong and effectively “patient blaming” all that happens is people become even more annoyed and continue the grievance.
Am not sure that you would get any satisfaction by meeting with medical staff. Staff including nurses will have been advised/told what to say and consultant will continue to insist they have done nothing wrong. Personally I think only logical way forward would be involve ombudsman. Possibly you need to consider employing a “no win no fee” solicitor. Am sure this isn’t way you would want to go but suspect involving ombudsman, you should have someone “legal” in your corner.
Thank you Bevvy. How right you are. Strangely the nurse and another consultant who came to assist have 'shopped' him for not taking notice of the nurses concerns or xrays of the lung as it went down. A lot of other stuff went on including drains in the cathlab that the anaesthetist couldn't use so it took 10 mins to find others and then the mispositioning of the drain 3 times once I had gone into collapse. I have a nw/nf solicitor who is willing to look at it all and says not to go to the ombudsman at this point. The hospital have accepted that they messed up but no offer to compensate. As you say, an acknowlegement and apology from the consultant would probably have finished it but I cannot allow this man to potentially kill other patients because of his attitude and incompetance. And he is head of the devices clinic!
I had some news today from the consultant who I now see who came to help on the day and eventually put in the device. He is now clinical lead of the department and the doctor who did those things to me has been forced to step down from the position. The department has been in mayhem over it and in my new doc's words ' things which had been festering ( in regard to the original doc) have been pouring into the open and he is virtually ostracised. There has been a flurry of retraining in all sorts of aspects to do with the procedure. Strangely he is still working which must be difficult for everybody. It seems that they are now waiting to see what I do. I also learned that my GP, who was a very close friend has stopped speaking to the doc who did this and is sending all of his referrals to the doc whom I saw today.
Wow! What a result already! Thank goodness the other person is now the clinical lead and the floodgates have been opened giving others the opportunity to speak more freely about what they have witnessed. Perhaps this will give them enough clout to get the bugger out!
I hope that YOU are able to benefit from all this change or at least to get some deserved compensation, but if not, you will at least know that you have probably saved the lives of others (possibly many) by blowing the whistle!
Yes I have to speak with my solicitor now. The staff in the cathlab that day have also undergone more training in sedation because he tried to blame the nurse administering it for my 'panic' I do feel that this is unfair because everybody knows whose fault it all was.
G*d, no wonder you're furious Littlepom, trying to blame you the patient the arrogant ba**and. I'm spitting nails for you with expletives too. How absolutely dare he, I bet you didn't move at all.Hopefully you'll have the strength to pursue it and get a result although it'll take a while. So pleased the nurses also shopped him too. The whole story is/was terrifying for you, the very very least you deserve is a grovelling apology although I would hope that you're eventually properly compensated. He nearly killed you for heavens sake.
I hope you sleep alright tonight - I know I wouldn't after receiving all that.
Thank you peege. My friends have been very good insisting that I don't read it again until my kids come home. It was very distressing to read what happened and also what my daughter saw. His letter was all about how tired he was due to the time it took and how the shock and distress has affected him!
The fact that he has said how tired he was and how the shock and distress has affected him shows, in my view shows a great weakness in his defence. Being tired is not a defence to incompetence. Being sleepy is not a defence to killing someone. If you took the guy to court it might take 10 years for them to settle and be a huge burden on you and the family. (A lot of negative energy.) My advice is is to make sure in writing that you hold him and the hospital responsible for the errors and and that you will bring a claim against the hospital for negligence. That you should be a persistent thorn but not expect any resolution. Enjoy the ride. By all means explore the position with the ombudsman but not at the expense of giving up your legal rights to sue.
I have sent them a reply which says exactly what you suggest and am in contact with a solicitor. I may report the con to the GMC. In the meantime Iam trying not to let the whole thing exacerbate the ptsd which I have been left with.
Yes. I hope you feel stronger standing up to such a squalid response. But that would be typical of a hospital, never admitting negligence. Never giving an inch and hoping the patient is befuddled by tbeir professional 'doctorspeak'. Make sure you type up everything the nurses told you that went wrong, their names and when they said it to you. Use music as a counterpoint to cheer you. We on this site know how articulate and focused you are on nailing the truth and saying it as it is. Once they see this in your writing they will think again.
Oh my goodness Littlepom! It’s disgraceful! I agree with Bevvy though that he’s probably following his advisories & told not to admit to a mistake! I’ve never needed to make a complaint but I’m guessing I would go the next step! 💐
Oh LP!! How unbelievably insulting. Not good enough. Whatever you do I assume you will have people to support you? Medico legal? Not that you will want to go down the litigation route but it might help to have a bit of weight with you. I am looking forward to hearing what your children’s reaction is. Rage I imagine… Lots of love and the gentlest of hugs
What is crazy about these situations is that patients only feel litigatious when they meet the arrogance of these types of doctors. Sometimes it looks like the only way to get answers and explanations. If they had more humility, honesty, candour and integrity patients would settle for an apology. It is so counterproductive. Xx
I can say that I know how you feel, having had a very arrogant surgeon tell me to stop being stupid, on three occasions. Unfortunately for me, I was right each time. I think there is a specific breed of arrogance, in certain of these gents. I have not heard of a female surgeon who acted like this, maybe I am wrong. I should imagine that the nurse who was ignored was female, I hope you do get some recompense for all this, good that you have a supportive family.
👋Littlepom, The standard of care expected of a doctor, degree of prudence and caution a person under a duty of care must have. There’s no place inside ICU walls or otherwise for such an arrogant consultant.
That being said, it’s really best to seek out legal advice from a lawyer regarding medical negligence cases. Good luck LP
OMG that is awful. What an arrogant & patronising attitude 😠. You should definitely pursue further action with your families help. I do hope you can get a better outcome than this!
I expect you’re Furious. Especially when they skirt around what happened , trying to excuse what they did wrong. Unfortunately they are so scared of Lawyers being involved you are never going to get an explanation & the truth without going to Court. Bit of a catch 22 when all you want originally is an apology and for Someone to tell you he has been dragged over the Coals and disciplined to save Someone else from going through the same thing. I’m Sorry you are having to deal with this but hopefully your Children will push for you , I’m sure your Daughter was so freaked out by it that she will be as angry as you x
Exactly. The whole of the hospital knew of this disaster on the day following, the staff in the cardiac unit were shocked and so traumatised that they were offered counselling and the nurse who was with me almost gave up her career. It is the consultant who is still in denial that he did anything wrong. As you say, an admission from him and an apology would have settled it because I am not interested in taking tax payers’ money from the hospital. Unfortunately I have to prevent him doing the same damage to someone else because he has learned nothing.
I remember reading about your problems last year, and am so happy to read that you’ve survived, but reading of your experiences today has made me hopping mad. I’ve got steam coming out of my ears!!!I have never been in similar circumstances fortunately but if I was in your position I would want that nincompoop to be struck off so he can’t harm anyone else with his high handedness. How patronising! It gets me really angry when drs, and other people, lump all elderly people together, assuming we’re all the same. If I was in your position I would want to take this to the NHS Ombudsman rather than meeting the medical staff. You will need the support of your family and maybe your MP to get to a satisfactory conclusion. Please let us know how you’re getting on. My thoughts are with you.
How awful but main thing is that you survived. You have done the right thing by making a complaint to hospital. For your own peace of mind maybe leave it there. They will cover up which will cause you further distress. If you take legal action any compensation will be tiny as they will argue you that you already had damaged lungs. I doubt that many people will agree with me but taking legal action is very stressful and drags on and on and only people who benefit are lawyers. An alternative to legal action is to report him to BMA. Hospital should already have done this but worth following up.
To be fair, they threw up their hands and told me what had happened and that it was their fault as soon as I was conscious enough to understand. There is a lot more to the report than I could put on here. They interviewed 50 people twice! I do think that I shall have to report the consultant to the GMC because although he cannot get away from what he didn’t do, he is refusing to acknowledge the faults in himself which led him to behave that way.
On the damaged lungs issue. They had a meeting of the committee at the hospital before I was offered the procedure and decided that many people with lung problems have these devices and that I was no more at risk than anyone else. I had also asked the consultant three times, my own resp con, and again before going into theatre what would happen if I had a pneumothorax. I was told every time ( quite flippantly) that a drain would be inserted - but not that they would wait three hours! His post op letter to my GP ( his close friend) and four page responses to my complaint points is nothing more than an act of denial and an exercise in victim blaming.
It is so awful having to go through what you have been through and then being regarded as the problem. This is why I would hesitate to take legal action you will have years of lies, excuses, accusations of such crimes as being old etc. He will still be riding high as any compensation will be paid by his insurers. Look after yourself and stay strong, don't let the bar stewart beat you. xx
I’m not worried about dealing with solicitors. I am used to it as I had an eight year fight to get out of my marriage and to get the money which was rightfully mine. As I can be a thorn in the side of the hospital and particularly the consultant for a very long time the lesson is ‘ don’t p..s off an old lady who has too much time on her hands!’ 🤣
I went through this process between my knee op in 2004 and the Health Service Ombudsman's findings about 4 years later. You need to have a lot of emotional stamina to see the process through. The hospital I complained about deliberately dragged their feet at every stage, and I had to start legal proceedings at my own expense before the Ombudsman process had finished because of the time limitation of 3 years from the incident.
The hospital was resistant throughout the process. Even when they received the Ombudsman's findings (supporting 8 of my 13 points about poor care) the hospital acted on none of the Ombudsman's recommendations towards me. I had to drop the legal proceedings as it was a case of my word against the hospital's, and with a 50-50 balance of proof I could be hit with a large legal bill if the case failed in court.
As you have described, the consultant concerned was very arrogant and belittling. The positive final outcome was that he no longer worked for the hospital trust by the end of my action. But sadly, a friend who stayed in the same hospital last year, ended up with the same sort of damage through neglected care, so the hospital has not learned any of the lessons.
I would still go through the process again, though, if I had to.
That is dreadful. I have to say that the care I received from staff inthe hospital was exemplory. It is the consultant who was at fault and is in denial. We are a very small ‘village’ in these parts and I have heard through the grapevine that the staff are still deeply upset and angry with him because his behaviour has caused the whole team to be criticised
I bet you are. Wow the arrogance of ignoring all around is unforgivable. A moving patient would be allowed to settle if you thought it was detrimental. Did they explain all this to you after the procedure? Duty of candor, or did you have to first put in a complaint before discovering what actually went on? Was there an anaesthetist? What were your continual observations? Exactly when did it happen? Lots of questions to be asked. If I was given 10 minutes to ultimate death then i’d be pretty furious. What happened to ‘first do no harm’
Dreadful after all you have been through this man wont even offer an apology and you could have put this to bed, disgraceful and no wonder you are hopping mad. Good that you have your family behind you. Sadly so many do get away with it and continue in their role, instead of being struck off. Keep us updated x
They did explain that Ihad almost died and why. My kids were there, my son having been called fromSouthampton to Warwick because they believed that I was dying. There is no getting away from the fact that I had a pneumothorax which was not acted upon for 3 hrs due to the consultant not taking me seriously then not listening to the frantically concerned nurse.
I think some people lie through their teeth to get out of a serious situation. I once put in a complaint to my local hospital regards a wrong diagnosis which has resulted in me having a extremely long incision in my calf to find my Achilles’ tendon yet When I went to a different hospital after being in excruciating pain over the weekend a young junior doctor made the right diagnosis in minutes but as he told me they had to search right up my thigh for the end of my tendon due to being told to walk on it by the other doctor. My complaint was dismissed as the first doctor could have been right !!! I now has a slight disability in this leg and suffer from tightness up my leg from time to time.
Sorry I have babbled on littlepom. I hope you proceed with your case and get a good outcome. I was in your neck of the woods last Friday on my way to my nephews in Redditch
That is so frustrating for you. Because there is so much ongoing evidence from xrays, drug records, staff interviews, the hospital cannot deny what happened. I think that he and they are hoping that I miss the fact that he kept refusing to acknowledge that he had given me a pneumothorax until I collapsed and went into respiratory failure. It is his job that will be on the line if I go to the GMC. If there is a lesson in this it is ‘don’t p..s off an old woman who has very little to fill her time’ 😊
Shamefully a lot of these consultants think they are gods. I seem to remember your daughter was very involved after the event and I suspect she will be gunning for him now. If you have legal protection on your house insurance you could also ask for their help if your nw nf doesn’t work out. These things are dragged out hoping you will lose the will to fight on. Good luck. X
Patronising git! I have nothing useful to add to what others have said except “keep prodding away at him”. I expect he knows he “did you wrong” but can’t/won’t admit it for fear of being sued or of damage to his reputation and career. Other staff know however so I imagine his life is fairly uncomfortable and that he is now very careful. At least, that’s what we can hope. Good luck.
Thinking of you and sending you gentle hugs.Having been on the receiving end of a respiratory professors wrong diagnosis and his temper tantrum once he was proved wrong I totally understand you.
I do hope that whatever you and your family decide to do re the report you now have brings you closure.
So shocking LP. Almost unbelievable except that it actually happened. I feel you need representation alongside yourself at the meeting from a medical negligence expert if you can find one. Also I wouldnt see it as an either/or having the meeting OR contacting the ombudsman. Do both!!
Good luck.
(Ps: I always forget to say when i see Warwick mentioned that I grew up in Knowle, just down the road from you. Seems a long way away now.)
Hi Littlepom. No wonder you're livid about this man. Unfortunately he seems to fall into the category of the self important and arrogant, an affliction I've observed in too many doctors over the years. I've also met many excellent and dedicated ones I'm happy to say. His type are so convinced of their own skills and infallibility that they are blind and deaf to any contradiction and haven't the humility to accept that they can be to blame for anything even when the facts smack them in the face. Littlepom you have a wealth of fact and witnesses on your side which prove his culpability. You and your family will decide on the best course of action I'm sure. From what you have said you want to make sure that this man accepts responsibility but also he's unlikely to do that. So I would look at reporting him to the GMC and give them a point by point sequence of events and tell them you want to know what disciplinary action has been taken with regard to this man and what safeguards have been put in place to ensure it doesn't happen to anyone else. Thank goodness you survived his incompetence.
I would take it further he thinks you will let it drop so he csn get of the hook. You do right to discuss with your family. I hope you do take it further how many more people he will do it to and they might not be so lucky. He needs to be struck off and hauled in front the medical board.
It sounds like meeting with staff may be what you need to reassure you.Unfortunately,rare accidents do happen and we do sign consent forms after being usually given details of risk.
The risk signed for was of a pneumothorax. Not for a pneumothorax that wouldn't be acted on for 3 hrs and until I was 10 mins from death. His refusal to listen to anybody as I deteriorated was negligence, not an accident.
Thanks. I have had sessions with a clinical psychologist who diagnosed ptsd. I have been offered treatment but don't feel able to go through it until other matters are settled. They also offered my daughter and staff psychological help.
My dear friend, I'm lost for words. The word I'd like to describe your consultant I don't think will be allowed on this forum. I detest so much, the assumption that because I'm older I might not understand a medical situation or not know about my health condition, when due to your wise words ever since I joined this forum, I'm very knowledgeable. This is not good but please do take care xxxx Sending all my love xx
Well done you for standing up for yourself. I’m afraid they don’t admit their mistakes and they stick together. You’re very lucky the nurse stood up for you. I had dealings wit a hospital with my Mum. She wasn’t looked after properly. My Dad and Uncle went to visit one day and there was a lump of poo on the floor. I went over to a nurse and asked her to remove it. Then when my Mum came home she had a massive big sore going from front to back. I said to her about it but she didn’t want to complain. A couple of days later she told me what was happening. She would ring the bell in the morning and the nurse came she asked to go to the loo. It was breakfast time. So they left her. Well Mum had had strokes and couldn't control her bladder very well. She called the nurse again and the nurse went to her. She pulled back the covers saw she was wet, pushed her back on the bed and left her in it until they cleared everything out of the way. They did this on a couple of occasions. She was bright red around that area. I said I’m not having that and we started writing letters. I had a phone call from the ward Sister who was a male. Your Mother never had any bed sores. We know because she was showered before she came home. I was so angry at that. He even denied her being pushed back in the bed. I put my point over that we had carers at home and she had never ever had a bed sore. He realised I meant business and said he thought he knew who it was and he would keep his eye on her. I left it like that. But his manager had been notified as well. They cannot write us old people off. It’s disgusting they even try. You can see I’m still angry about this and it was a long time ago. So you go girl stand up for all of us.
Blimey - I get riled by bad delivery services so would be exploding if I were you. A full unreserved apology would be a start and the consultant being struck off would be good. How would you go about a civil case against him I wonder? Breathe deeply ( now you can). And report him to the medical council !! If you clearly told him he had punctured your lung and he ignored you it’s akin to assault or GBH.
Omg LP I am absolutely fuming for you. What an arrogant t**t he is. And blaming the victim! I hope you do go all the way and he gets his comeuppance. I understand though it will be terribly stressful for you. But I admire your determination to do what’s right to prevent him from killing someone. And bravo to the nurses and staff who told it as it is and supported you. I wish you good health LP. Diane 😊 xx
Dear LP, so sorry this missive came when your children were away. I know you are a tough cookie but this is horrendously difficult and stressful even to read whilst alone. Very wise to wait until you discuss your options with your family.
As a family we have had two complaints to deal with on behalf of loved ones shortly after their deaths due to negligence.
I would just say it takes forever and takes a lot of energy and also takes a toll on your health.
I wouldn’t dream of advising you sweetheart. You are a very wise, eloquent, strong woman. Going by what you have explained (and there’s more) you have right on your side and nurses and consultants who appear not to be closing ranks. It is going to be a balance, as I think you know, between pushing for this vile doctor being brought to book, by whatever means you and your family choose and the effect it will have on you and, of course, your dear daughter who was there and family.
Whatever you decide dear friend it will be right for you and we are here for you.
Three cheers for the nurse who tried to tell him, though, and for you for having the will to pursue this as it really needs to be done! The man sounds less than competent, to put it politely.xx Moy
I think it to be the gold standard to perform at least one ABG. However, I’ve never had one. It’s been 5 years since my last echocardiogram. I’m not on oxygen. Yet my my sats upon getting up are 76-80 now. I’ve never been offered a 6mwt. These are basic gold standard tests for my end stage copd. In this passed time I’ve developed left and right heart failure. No. Not officially diagnosed but I know. My peripheral edema is telling. Due to Covid I’ve just slipped through. It does seem negligent however.
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What A Birthday I Had !
Emphysema help please I’m 25
update: tomorrow I’m at the hospital for suspected head & neck cancer
