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[Adamj]

12 MILLION people in the USA get misdiagnosed every year. Keep fighting for yourself if something doesn’t feel right you know your body best. I don’t really have a fight in me anymore to fight for myself I’m so drained and tired of doctors not listening and just throwing antidepressants and saying here numb yourself oh and try these benzos or take Benadryl/hydroxyzine it will make you feel better shit yeah give me a ANTIHISTAMINE to just knock me out and make me dead to the world.

[endofheartache1290]

I agree that people should follow up with their doctors and have better communication but I also think it's important to make it clear that doctors are still your best bet at treatment if you are sick. They are trustworthy and have spent years in school and spent countless hours in residency just to get fully trained. Most doctors know what they are doing. Of course there are bad ones out there. There are bad people in every profession. That doesn't mean that the majority of doctors are not doing their best. Also, doctors are not infallible. Mistakes can and do happen, hence why I started this by saying that communication is key. But that is something people have to accept. Doctors are people too. They are not magicians and they are not exempt from mistakes. Again good communication is key but that goes both ways. Sometimes we have to accept that doctors know better then we do. Because at the end of the day they do.

[Blueruth in reply to endofheartache1290]

”Because at the end of the day they do.”

No they don’t. At the end of the day you die alone.

They are paid by insurance companies or governments unless you are rich enough to pay out of pocket. That has long created an environment where meds are king because they get patients out the door. I argue we wouldn’t have so many variations of SSRIs without insurance systems. Doctors have education…that doesn’t mean they use it.

This is one area where I agree with Adam although I don’t necessarily think they are wrong either.

[endofheartache1290 in reply to Blueruth]

Like I said in my post, of course there are some bad doctors. Just like there are bad people in every profession. So what? That somehow negates that doctors have extensive medical training and need to complete an exorbitant amount of work to even get licensed to practice medicine. No. It doesn't negate that. Doctors sometimes do know better, especially when multiple doctors over the span of years, have confirmed the same things. Literally what you are saying is illegal. You could easily get a second diagnosis and show that you are sick then sue the original doctor who just pushed you out the door for millions. They cannot just excuse your medical issues without a valid justification. They legally cannot, it doesn't matter who is paying them. And for that matter who do you think pays for most medical research now? Governments. But your telling me that just because governments paid for it it's all bad and terrible? Did you get the COVID vaccine? Or get treatment for COVID? That was paid for by the government. Insurance companies also paid for treatments and other things. Just cause it's the government doesn't mean it's bad. Unless you are going to speak out against vaccines and current medical research. And I'm not arguing only treating people who can afford it is good. That is a political issue antithetical to the point. My views on how how medicine should be covered does not change the fact that the majority of doctors are trying their best to help you. They are not simply just raking in mountains of money like you seem to think. And just so you know, yes I do support universal healthcare and no IP restrictions for medicine or research. Drugs shouldn't be protected under IP and should be lower cost or free. All research should be open source as we have proven that is a better system. Not that it matters but there it is. It doesn't change my initial point.

Now this is the final point. Doctors are good at treating the body. Most doctors can't or don't understand the mind because they are not specialized in it. That is a completely different matter. And why we go see people who are trained in that area, such as therapists and psychiatrists. And yes of course there are still bad people in these groups as well. Of course a normal PCP is going to suggest medicine and drugs to treat your mental health. What else are they going to do? Realistically what are they going to do? They are not therapists. They are not qualified to be and so of course they don't get it most of the time. That still doesn't mean they don't want to help or are not trying to help. They are simply doing what they know how to do. They see a condition and they are trying to treat it medically. It's that simple. Is that the best system? No. And I never said that Doctors where the best at treating mental health. They are good at what they do. Practicing medicine and examining the body. That is all.

[Blueruth in reply to endofheartache1290]

You read a lot into my 2 paragraphs and came up with some pretty dramatic and incorrect conclusions about my opinions.

Reacting to their employer, insurance companies, at the end of the day doesn't make them "bad". I think that is the difference between what you and I saying. Knowing who is paying the bill is prudent in any field. It isn't a reflection on their skills. I never think they know "more than me". I ask for their advice and make a decision to follow it or not based on what I know about myself because they simply do not know more about me than me.

"Of course a normal PCP is going to suggest medicine and drugs to treat your mental health. What else are they going to do? Realistically what are they going to do? " Refer you to the appropriate doctor and therapist... this is actually the exact case where you can't assume they know best. MH is difficult because you may not be in the frame of mind to do the research but if you can then assuming they know what is best for your body is naive.

[endofheartache1290 in reply to Blueruth]

Sure you can be mad at who is paying them. Okay. But does that make them, meaning the doctors, wrong or bad? No. Again that is a separate issue. However, I'm sorry to say doctors do know more than you about medicine. That is what they have studied. Your quick google searches will never compare to 10+ years worth of study in a specialized field. Yes on average it takes a doctor 10-14 years to get fully licensed. And yes, you know about what your wants are more. You know about what your experiences are more. This was never in question. It's why I said there needs to be clear communication with doctors because they are not in your body and can't just magically know your symptoms. But you will never know more about the body, medicine, and how to treat conditions more than they do. And second opinions are great. I highly encourage second opinions if you are concerned or just want to be super careful. As I said, doctors are human and can make mistakes. But there is a reason people shouldn't self diagnose. There is a reason that doctors still need to see other doctors even though they can care for themselves and know their own experiences. People tend to be horrible at being impartial, especially when it comes to themselves. So sure you know your experiences better. You are the one feeling them. However, you do not know how to treat it better. You do not know how to diagnose better. You, in some cases, may not even know what all of your realistic options are for help on your own. And some of the self help stuff you read could actually be life threatening if you don't know better. For example, a common "safe" and natural thing people recommend for anxiety is kava root. And if you just google kava root and anxiety all you will find is stuff about how good it is for your anxiety. Well this "safe" alternative to medicine can kill me because I have a liver condition and turns out kava root is really closely linked to liver damage. It's not always clearly cut black and white. This is why you need an impartial 3rd party who has extensive knowledge. The only thing you can know more of is what you actually feel. And what you prefer your treatment to be. Doctor's can't force you to take a treatment they can only give you the best option. Whether or not you agree is entirely up to you. But that doesn't mean you are right just because you want it or prefer it.

And to your second point, doctors do give out referrals to behavioral health. That was never in question. I was stating a fact. What is the doctor themselves, as they are, supposed to do? People go to them without knowledge of all their options and want their doctors to help them. And so of course the doctor is going to "help" by doing what they are trained to do. Treat the body. If you can do your own research for mental health great, that still doesn't mean you know more about the body. Again, you know your wants and your experiences and that is literally it. This is the exact reason people get anxiety about their health. They get a few symptoms, do research without truly knowing what they are looking for or what they are doing and then panic because clearly they know they have some horrible disease based off of a few hours of reading. This is the same issue with mental health and self diagnosis. Do you know how many mental health issues share a similar pattern? It's a lot. Bi Polar can be mistaken for schizophrenia as an example. This is why self diagnosis and all that is not encouraged by any professional in any field. Because you do not know more than an expert and you are extremely biased in your own thoughts. Again, both doctors and therapists need to see other doctors and therapists to get treatment. They shouldn't just treat themselves. And to your final point. I never claimed you should assume your doctor knows best how to treat the mind. I literally pointed out that they are not qualified to do so. Like I word for word stated this. But they do know how to treat the body. Just like you shouldn't assume a therapist knows how to treat asthma. But they do know how to treat the mind. And they know far more options than we do normally. Also this is why there is specialized medicine and you don't go to an ENT to treat your gastrointestinal problems. You find the person who is specialized in that field.

[Blueruth in reply to endofheartache1290]

this is getting silly.

“However, I'm sorry to say doctors do know more than you about medicine.” I didn’t say they know less than me about meds. I said they do not know more than me about me. My doctors will agree. That is why they present information they don’t tell me what to do.

Good day.

[endofheartache1290 in reply to Blueruth]

Your exact words were "I never think they know "more than me".". So you did in fact state that they don't know as much as you. I also said medicine as a catch all term meaning treatment, diagnosis, etc. Not just medication.

And again, of course you know your experiences. That is why you have to tell a doctor what is wrong. That is self evident. How else would they know where to start searching for the problem. But that is where your expertise ends. What is your point, you experience things? Okay, how does that get back to what you originally said? You disagreed with me by saying that doctors don't know the best way to treat the body. You repeated this several times, as quoted above. So you either believe they know better or you believe they don't which i have already proven to be false.

And yes you know your own experiences and can choose your treatment. Cool. Again you could be wrong. People opt to not get chemo and pray for healing all the time. Doesn't make it any less of a bad choice on their part? No. I never said that doctors do tell you what to do. I stated the exact opposite several times. This is my point, you are just saying you know what your symptoms are. Okay. Cool. But does that mean you know better than your doctors about what is going on or what treatment should look like? No. And that has been the point of this entire thread. I'll drop it here cause I don't want to hijack this post.

[Mrspjsmom]

My husband keeps telling me doctor's are like mechanics, if you don't like your's find a new one. Easier said than done!!! Try to keep fighting. You are your own best advocate. If you need an antihistamine ask for a referral to an allergist and an ENT. After having 12 sinus infections one winter I found out I needed surgery to widen my sinus openings so they could drain.

[Blueruth]

soon to be legal in some states so I think it is a fair question…have you looked into psychedelics? You would probably have to grow them. There is interesting research on mushrooms and anxiety, depression other mental health treatment.

[DodgeDhanda]

That means in less than 30 years from when it started the whole of the US population will get misdiagnosed

[Trainchaser]

its a damn shame that it is so

[designguy]

The reality of anxiety is that it makes you believe the physical symptoms are real and if you have checked everything else out physically and it's fine, it could very well just be anxiety that you mistakenly think is real because it has tricked you into believing it is real. Just because it feels real doesn't mean it's real. This is a common mistake of people with anxiety disorder. They don't refer to anxiety as "the trickster" for nothing. You might consider that it really is just anxiety and put your energy toward learning more about it and how to constructively deal with it, you actually have nothing to lose by doing so and a lot to possibly gain.

[designguy]

That is very true and the irony is that it is a part of us that thinks it is helping us but since we are now adults, it no longer has to. We ultimately want to make friends with it and listen to and try to understand what it is telling us.

[Experiment1982739903]

Cure the disease and you lose the patient and their money. Treat the symptoms and you have a patient for life(and their money).

[designguy]

Yes, you are so right, it takes awareness and understanding and persistence but it is possible to heal and get on with life. I've read about it being like to old Chinese finger puzzle trick where you stick your finger in the tube and the more you try to pull it out the tighter it becomes, it's a perfect metaphor for anxiety and how to truly deal with it. Another irony is how simple the solution is but because of the intense emotions of it, it's hard to believe it's so simple.

[designguy]

That's it!