Hi Guys- I’m new to this group. Checking this out from a recommendation. Diagnosed at 46 - Gleason 10/stage 4, kitchen sink thrown at it. Now 48 and PSA 0.1. Doing what I can to keep things normal for my family.
What supplements are folks taking, doses and is there science supporting them?
The science is pretty low quality, but the internet is full of people touting lab and mouse studies as if they were proof. The only one I'd recommend is sulforaphane. Most supplements are harmless and useless, but taking them makes one feel like the disease is more in one's control, so I do get it. Just avoid the ones that have known or suspected harms, like Vitamin E, selenium, glutathione (or any strong anti-oxidants), and high doses of Vitamin D or calcium. Check with your oncologist before taking whatever you're thinking of taking - there may be drug interactions you're not aware of.
Hi Allen, I guess that during treatment with drugs the liver is under heavy load.
Do you have any experience/knowledge on supplements/herbs that could potentially offset the effects of drugs on the liver ? Seems Milk Thistle does a good job. are there any others ?
The problem with silibinin/silimarim is the same problem faced by almost all natural supplements - our bodies are very good at preventing foreign chemicals from getting in, and destroying quickly those that do. The active ingredients are very quickly conjugated, which renders them inactive, and eliminated. Only 10% of a dose of silibinin gets through unconjugated, and its half-life is less than an hour:
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/157...
Like most chemicals, it works just fine when INJECTED into rats because it avoids the metabolism that occurs with oral intake.
Be careful about taking anti-oxidants - they may interfere with your body's natural defenses against cancer.
I thought antioxidants were good for stopping cancer?
Just the opposite. Oxidation creates molecules called reactive oxygen species (ROS) that are needed for apoptosis and for the immune system to destroy cancer cells. This came to light when the SELECT trial found that men who took Vitamin E (an antioxidant) were MORE likely to get prostate cancer. Since then biochemical studies have highlighted the importance of ROS. The positive effects of exercise are blocked by antioxidants too.
My med Onc recently prescribed high dose Vit D (50,000/wk) and recommend calcium supplement (600mg) for bone health- thoughts on that?
What do YOU think after reading these?
• "Continuing widespread use of vitamin D for osteoporosis prevention in community-dwelling adults without specific risk factors for vitamin D deficiency seems to be inappropriate."
thelancet.com/journals/lanc...
•"The doses of calcium (500-1000mg) and vitamin D (200-500IU) that have been tested are inadequate to prevent loss of bone mineral density in men undergoing androgen deprivation therapy. In light of evidence that high levels of dietary calcium and calcium supplement use are associated with HIGHER RISKS for cardiovascular disease and ADVANCED PROSTATE CANCER, intervention studies should evaluate the safety as well as the efficacy of calcium and vitamin D supplementation in these men."
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...
• Also, read my article, especially the section on bone mineral density:
Do you have your supplements program for PC described on the forum?
There are only under one hundred naturalpathic onocologist in the US. Mine Is Dr Michael Uzick of Genesis medicine in Tuc. Az. .. This man lives to fight and assist cancer patients...My choice was severe at the onset. ..Take ashot at conventional treatments or die quickly a painful pelvic death like childbirth. That’s how they put it to me. .. Two out of the last 3yrs I’ve had no visible signs or Psa. I’d be dead with out adt and RT that brought the C down. I accredit this initial success (even if only temporary) greatly to following a complete nutritional path set for me by Dr. Uzick.. I had the$.. It is costly . But I’m still here enjoying my altered lifestyle as much as I can. No cure For APC is what they say... I’ll take the good days as they come.. they outweighs the bad for me right now. That’s all we can ask for.. some reprieve in the storm. Try some spirulina.. I’m drinking it right now..it looks like algae on the pond. Mmm,m. Ribbit , feeling froggy, . Go for nutrition if it’s right for you. As T_A stated you must be careful on some things.. Good luck.
Instead of Ribbit Ribbit... try KneeDeep KneeDeep to imitate a frog.
Good luck and Good Health.
j-o-h-n Saturday 05/19/2018 12:37 PM EDT
Sounds froggy to me.” But I’m nobody.”. if bored watch Johnny deep in deadman. A different sku on life and death. “Nobody” is a main character in this film . It used to be “balls deep,,,” for me I used to go “ balls out” partying during those collage age years. Dr page took care of those two for me..no more balls. I still have the will to live and resolve to enjoy what I can . Keep joy for life in our hearts at all times. There will come a day for all APC warriors to lay down their arms . God bless those including Paul that are there now. For the rest of us. Keep pushing forward. Even if it’s 2 steps forward and one step back. Skipping down this path .. knee deep!
No matter what Nal . APC patients that dont pay attention to diet and make changes are nieve and in denial of simple facts of healthy eating .. If not doing extra nutrients. At least eat healthy. Or not? Some people just don’t care.. In fact most of the elderly guys here that I know don’t follow anything except thier American diet. Every time we came out of Radiation there is a bowl of snickers and m&ms as you step out. The guys gobbled it down . I ask my two 78 yr cohorts if they’re going to stop eating meat? The shock on their faces.. They both said in sync. “. I couldn’t live without meat” surger is another one .. Everybodies so touchy...I love sugar and deserts myself .. It does not love us...You are the nutrient guy with great success. Keep it up! Wish you a long happy life my friend.. Thanks.
From my reading it seems the meat issue was really about animal (mammal and poultry) fat and not healthy lean meat. I live off the land - salmon from the ocean and moose from the forest. Am I tricking myself that this is an exception???
Living off of the land. What choice do you have? Moose is pretty darn healthy. Salmon fresh caught. Mmmm..
To My understanding it is hard to beat wild salmon from the source, as well as grass fed moose from the delta.
I hope that WHATEVER is working for you continues to work. With an n of 1, there is no way of assessing what is working for you, perhaps in spite of what you are doing, and what is not working. That's why we HAVE to rely on randomized clinical trials rather than a single man's personal testimonies. Scientific proof and your personal anecdotes are two different things. I do understand the need to wrest some feeling of control from this horrible disease. I did it myself! But when I delved deeper, and started seeing the actual harm I might be doing, I stopped.
I broke down and got a fish fillet at Mickey D’s In honor of my dad. He loved those things. I got it at the drive drive thru $4.34. Dam ! I thought they were$1.99 remember when they were a dollar. What a fried mess of poorest quality ingredients . But it can take us back to a simpler time when we ate whatever we wanted without second thinking it.
I suspect they want to understand what all patients come up with when using Dr Google instead of real evidence. Urologists hear this stuff from patients constantly and it's good for them to know what is circulating out there. I am glad that you are not advocating to others whatever you are doing for yourself. Those that do may be unwittingly harming others. Anyone who says "I know what I am doing" in the face of so many unknowns is asking for trouble, in my opinion. I prefer to start with humility in face of all I don't know (and nobody knows) about the biochemistry of progression.
No good replicated science on supplements. eat healthy and exercise.
I take L-arginine and L-Taurine supplements for heart health as I battle atrial-fibrillation, which I also take prescription meds for. There IS science that supports the benefit of these supplements. CoQ10 is also good for heart health, to supplement losses that statin use incurs. Oh, and there is Magnesium and other things that I take, good for both the heart and for prostate cancer.
Didn't find the a-fib related research paper, but chew on these as examples of research on just one supplement -- there are many more.
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedheal...
healthline.com/health/argin...
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/171...
So, spare me the bull that supplements are worthless. Oh and I do exercise and try to eat healthy.
No waiting, I agree, I endulged on my diet my entire life. I loved the”Good” food high end mmmm, baked Alaska , all of that stuff. I do all natural things to promote my health. I m taking ADT and combatting side effects as we all do. I believe my diet and big nutrient list helps everything , including digestion . Important after being radiated .. and stripped of all hormones... women have more testosterone than I do. I t sure ain’t penis envy! Keep truckin !
Sorry but the research is very tentative as stated in each of the three. When you see the word "may" that means it's probably BS. But if you believe in it go for it. The placebo effect is real.
Ever heard of motherwort? It did quite I job on knock out mice with prostate tumors. Kill all 4 lines of prostate cancer. I used to take liquid motherwort and I dropper it in capsules. It was then down the hatch. It probably didn't do anything but I got great placebo pretending I was a mouse.
Short-term tactics to keep PSA in check
What age should your son have his PSA checked
Can someone check this?
\"Check your Fish Oil Capsules -- They're very likely to be rancid!\"
