Advanced Prostate Cancer
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Lets Read Article--> ncbi.nim.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5356655/---SubJect BIRM

Those who follow me know I use BIRM, and I have written about it and just recently wrote another reply to a curiosity seeker. That response followed one by Gregg, indicating the above article he found. Many might find it interesting. pjoshea[Patrick], seemed surprised about the cytotoxic ability of BIRM---Meaning in short hand an ability to kill dividing cells that do not belong in the body--->like cancer cells. I do not press the use of BIRM, as there had been lots of fun and jokes--and Gusgold named it Gator Blood--and he and I go back and forth allowing for some humor on a sometimes solemn forum. I mean we just lost 3 in the last 10 days.

As most know I do not like to recommend anyone to take something I write about--I take the position in public only of, [do your own research]. And the same would be true with the above research article. Which adds more fuel to the fire.

So to Gusgold, yes my teeth are back and I snared a wild Gnu--stuffed him after eating his innards and hung it on my wall--teeth are working fine!

Lets thank Gregg for digging up the article.

Nalakrtas

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A gnu? Is this a gnother thing like gator blood? What's gnext?

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A Gnu is an African antelope--and when they get too close to the waters edge, they become great food for Gators. We are funning.

Nalakrats

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The gator lays in wait for all ..

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Even though BIRM is not accepted as part of the "Standard of Care", I don't feel we should put it the same category as many "alternatives" becuase there is an understood mechanism of action against cancer and there has been research done on it.

I think we should all be interested in new ideas and solutions, even if they "are outside of the box" as long they can be evaluated scientifically. We should hold all treatment options to the same standards, regardless of whether they come from Big Pharma or the Amazon.

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Yes understood, but when there are months left on your OS time table, you do worry about standard of care---you do what you have to---Besides--if you research the hell out of the use of BIRM, against HIV/AIDS for over ten years--you cannot help but seek it out as a possible candidate for use against cancer.

Nalakrats

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I'm beginning to see that.

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I am going to try it. What do I have to lose. I’m all for the natural drugs from the amazon..

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What is Birm?

That link is not working for me.

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Go to Gregg57, his post--or the one by pjoshea--In my post you do not use the 3 dashes behind the last /

Nalakrats

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Still not working. May I ask the title of the article. I can search for that.

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ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles is right

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change the nim to nlm in the article address--I made a goof.

Nalakrats

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"We should hold all treatment options to the same standards, regardless of whether they come from Big Pharma or the Amazon.'

That is not possible. LOL

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It's been possible for me. I don't go for BS alternatives that have no scientific basis and no research. It's not difficult at all, just do your homework. LOL.

By the way, the article above took me about 10 minutes to find doing some research.

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Yes, but thank you for your time--it might help many---maybe!

Nalakrats

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When it comes to any treatment option, I think we just need to point people to the science and try to stay neutral about it. Because we are using a certain treatment it doesn't mean we have to take ownership of it and try to prove or defend it against those who may not agree. It is "a" treatment not "our" treatment. I appreciate you just putting it out there for people to consider.

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Interesting fact: The National Cancer Institute (NCI) estimates that 70 percent of the anti-cancer plants identified so far are rain forest plants. So I'm not surprised about BIRM's origin.

nationalgeographic.com/envi...

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God said he gave us, His People, everything we would need---and boy, do we need a cure for this nasty disease. Maybe it is not one silver bullet as in HIV/AIDS it took a cocktail of 3 bullets.

Nalakrats

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That was a true statement 60 or 70 years ago.

I would be dubious if that is so currently. For instance, how many of the drugs that we all talk about here regarding prostate cancer come from rainforest plants. I think none of them... except maybe one.

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Well there are thousands of unidentified plants--and the ones we know, we have not chemically taken them all apart. When in Tea Research as an Organic Synthesis Chemist, it took me 3 years just to separate the major Polyphenols, of Green Tea, a Year to Identify their structures and another year to synthesize them, so we could evaluate their uses and benefits because we needed pounds not grams. I brought in 5 PHD's from our Parent Company --Unilever--me being at Lipton Tea---so with me leading the charge with unlimited resources-it took that long to tell you today that if you get EGCG into your blood stream, it has a tendency to cause Apoptosis of Pca cells. My work was from 1964-1969. You can die starring at Molecular Distillation Columns.

Nalakrats

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"When in Tea Research as an Organic Synthesis Chemist, it took me 3 years just to separate the major Polyphenols"

OK, so that was 55 years ago instead of 60. LOL

That may be why the pharmas no longer tend to use that route. Nowadays they tend to use computers to search for possible compounds. Presumably, it is because they get more hits for less money that way. Somehow they are even able to do simulation testing of the compounds on computers.

Not to say that there isn't a lot of good stuff out there in nature's lab. But perhaps on a "cost-effective" basis, that mine is pretty played out.

Just for the heck of it, I think I am going to contact Dr. Lokeshwar and see what kind of phase I or II trial he could do with $1M.

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All I was doing was to let you all know--that I know how to spell Polyphenol--and some of my 6 papers have found use today. Remember 55 years ago---we were working with wooden tools--but we damn did get results.

The Compound Theanine used as a relaxant and sleep aid was discovered by me in 1967. It is an exotic Amino Acid in Tea--I developed the original Synthesis--which has been changed today to make for safety and efficiency---but I put the first 40 grams into a deep freezer in 1967, and it took over 40 years for someone to commercialize it. The work I had done on the Polyphenols--required help from work the Germans had done in 1936 on carbohydrate chemistry. Some will say there is nothing new under the sun.

Nalakrats

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Three cheers for chemistry and the chemists who create it! (Or should I say "discover" it?)

I'm glad to be alive today rather than 1,000 years ago, or even 100 years ago - though I kind of wish I could be alive 1,000 years from now - when all cancers will be preventable or quickly curable, and people (or our genetically engineered and cyber enhanced successors) will live for as long as they like.

Alan

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there may not be any people alive 1000 years from now, if the robots take over. sounds crazy but its more possible than most realize.

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George,

I think that even if the robots don't take over, the folks alive a thousand years from now may not be much like us. But whether carbon or silicon based, they truly will be our descendants - won't they? We will have created them. I just hope we do a real good job.

Alan

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But will the new Carbon or Silicon based beings be Jewish? That is what I see as the critical point. And if robots, will they have to be circumcised on the 8th day--and will they also have Bar Mitzvah's on their 13th year of creation?

Nalakrats

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Good morning Mr Nalakrats. Apart from our sharing of PCa I now have another link. Lipton's Tea was founded in Twickenham, England, my birthplace and the home of English Rugby. I have returned to live here. Shame it's not in a rain forest.

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I thought England was a rain forest. I live in the desert, so I appreciate any rain I see.

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Yes, Got your humor, considering where Tea does grow.

Nalakrats

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But Thomas Lipton was born In Glasgow. That's where he started his chain of stores. Decided to get into tea in 1888. His aim was affordable tea for the poor who shopped at his shops. Imported directly from Ceylon.

& as for rugby ... LOL!

Best, -Patrick

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I think Ceylon is now another Muslim Country today---and the so called orange pekoe tea---may not be the same stuff, I researched many many years ago--what was Ceylon Tea that I got, my first pure sample, of EGCG.

Nalakrats

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While it doesn't grow in the Amazon, the first and second line chemotherapies we use for prostate cancer are derived from the needles of the Pacific Yew tree. In many cases, drugs are first found in a natural form and then synthesized (mainly so they can be patented and make money).

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Yes that was the one exception I was thinking about.

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gregg57 wrote:

> ... 70 percent of the anti-cancer plants identified so far are rain forest plants.

As I understand it, tropical rain forest has a very large diversity of plants and animals in comparison with the ecology of temperate climates. It's not surprising that more diversity means more different kinds of molecules, which means more molecules with medical significance - not only for cancer but for all diseases and conditions (except maybe hypothermia :)

Alan

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thanks for correcting my link--I did in the thread--but prople are figuring it out.

Nalakrats

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Looks like mice studies.

Is there any reliable source for BIRM?

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Only One--see it on Amazon.com

Nalakrtas

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Sorry I screwed up, it should be ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles--I used ncbi.nim---got the i wrong where there should have been an l---my bad.

Nalakrats

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Hi Nakakrats

Where can I buy it and what is the common name so I can get some. How long have you been taking it? Thanks 👍

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Scrap that I’ve found and bought it. Look forward to adding it to my regime. 👍

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Men with few or no distant metastases take note, this line appeared in the abstract of the article:

> "BIRM ... showed selective efficacy on tumor growth; before tumors are established but limited efficacy when treated on existing tumors."

That makes me think that BIRM is especially effective in preventing or reducing the incidence of new metastases. ... Maybe. Of course mouse and man aren't exactly the same and most of the anti-cancer compounds appear to work better for some men than others.

Alan

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Alan, there is more Ecuadorian and Peru Information as to the success with BIRM, in Lung, Colon and Kidney Cancer--as to solid tumors----Prostate Cancer is really a new avenue, for the last 3 years--I mean the first funded research has just about begun at the Medical School of Miami---but they have for awhile been treating Prostate Cancer there using BIRM---and who knows what else.

After I had done about 60 hours of research on BIRM--mostly time spent trying to get info---I jumped on it for a part of my Protocol and Treatment about 2 years ago---actually I found my first receipt--it was for May of 2016. That is how long I have used it--have not missed a day.

The interesting thing that took me--was about the Hyaluronidase Enzyme, and it being identified as the transporting enzyme for Pca. My thoughts went immediately to Neuroendrocrine Pca. if you can stop those bastards from transporting to Bone and Visceral tissue, you can buy a bunch of time---maybe---and maybe it is not the transporting agent. But as research work goes on, I take it every day. Can't Hurt.

Nalakrats

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One problem I see with products like this is you buy them over the counter and there are so many different ones out there. A first time buyer would be lost with all of choices possibly ending up with something that lacks quality, purity, proper dosage etc. I know we all like to bitch about Big Pharma, but they do have controls on these things so you know what you are getting.

Based on your knowlege, research and experience which products out there are the best?

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That is a very wide range as to your question. What product categories and type products?---as to BIRM, I understand the Formulation of the plant extraction, goes back to the 1990's. I have used 22 bottles--and do not find any inconsistency.

gregg57--it is getting late and I got to shut down and eat dinner. I am all done in for tonight.

Shalom,

Nalakrats

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I did Birm under the recommendation of a U of Miami doctor. It did nothing.

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Drcrunch,

Can you tell us more about what happened that you weren't expecting, or didn't happen that you were expecting? For example, was your PSA increasing at the same rate as before you started taking it?

One of the problems is that we can't compare what happened with what would have happened if we hadn't done something (like take BIRM.) We can never be certain about what would have happened if we hadn't done it. That's why we need properly designed clinical trials that compare two groups of patients, one with the treatment, one without it, and all other things equal. If only we had the people and the money to run more trials. ...

Alan

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I had failed Surgery, and Radiation, as I was not a candidate for radiation as my cancer escaped the capsule before surgery--everything was dirty except Bones and Nodes were clear. ADT did not move the PSA much post surgery from near 8 to about 6---as soon as I added BIRM, and Pectasol-C--in 45 days went to undetectable and stayed there ever since. Not science----just implied intuition.

And i have Ductal Cribriform Pathology---only 0,4% get this and the OS from DX is 18 months---I passed that last June. So I pray a lot to Adonai--and I ask for Mercy and Grace--and a remission. So take your pick?

Nalakrats

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Psa went up and down for awhile. Ultimately went up and had to go on zytiga

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there is a 7X version---7 times stronger for those who have failed a few protocols moving towards or after Chemo---can be obtained at 408-612-4508. I do not recommend anyone to take anything I report, and for those that are interested in exploring things to do their own research.

Nalakrats

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Drcrunch,

Maybe the BIRM did help you. If the PSA went up and down for a while, perhaps it would have just gone up and up for a while without the BIRM.

Alan

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Logical thinking--always wins the day.

Nalakrats

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Have you tried the 7X version--I am not recommending---just reporting there is a product that is 7 times stronger. Obtainable by calling the distributor at 404-612-4508. Just more information.

Nalakrats

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A pretty remarkable response to a couple of almost unknown dietary supplements!

Don't know if you got the mercy or grace, but it's sure looking like a remission. Mazel tov.

Alan

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Shalom!

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I agree with Alan, You have done amazingly well with a difficult cancer through your own research and prayers. On that note I ordered some birm to give me more energy during chemo, I still have pectasol c, I will report back, and thanks Nala. I hope we did not cause a shortage because of a run on product

Dan

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There is a distributor in California----408-612-4508, and they also carry/get a product you can only get directly from Ecuador---a 7X Strength Version BIRM used for heavy duty needs.

Nalakrats

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I saw that, and I did sign up for the birm website, hoping to skip shipping cost. I bought at Amazon, I think I will do the regular this month and see how it goes, then maybe go to high strength. Thank You for all your research, and for helping everybody.

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augusta.edu/mcg/surgery/uro...

This address is for info on the primary investigator. Near the bottom of the page is #5. it reads as follows:

5. Dietary chemoprevention of prostate cancer using New World phytochemicals and Spices.

We were the first to demonstrate anti-cancer property of an Ecuadorian plant based fold medicine, BIRM. This led to a grant from NCCAM and extensive pre-clinical efficacy testing. We are the only group worked on this plant-based orally bioavailable anticancer product. (Dandekar DS, Lokeshwar VB, Cevallos-Arellano E, Soloway MS, Lokeshwar BL*. An orally active Amazonian plant extract (BIRM) inhibits prostate cancer growth and metastasis. Cancer Chemotherapy Pharmacololgy. 2003; 52(1):59-66.), This PI is the only one to show the anticancer activity of the Jamaican pepper, Allspice, against prostate cancer and demonstrate the anticancer compound, Ericifolin as the active ingredient. (Shamaladevi N,.,, Lokeshwar BL*. Ericifolin: a novel antitumor compound from allspice that silences androgen receptor in prostate cancer. Carcinogenesis 2013; vol.34 no.8 pp.1822–1832). This study also led to demonstration of Allspice extract’s activity against breast cancer by a unique mechanism of autophagy induced cell death. (Zhang L, et al and Lokeshwar BL* Oncotarget, 2015).

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Thanks for the contribution,

Nalakrats

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I am glad you posted about BIRM.

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hindawi.com/journals/jchem/...

journal of chemistry article on Allspice journal article. See above link

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I ordered birm from amazon. Husband just finished chemo. Can you tell me if you take more than recommended ??

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No---as I am not castrate resistant, and not showing Metastasis, at present. I do take it differently. I take as recommended twice a day---2 cc's. I do not mix it into anything. I take a 3 mm syringe--can get at any pharmacy, and squirt 2 cc's down the back of my throat. Sometimes I sip an ounce of water after. Nasty tasting---you get use to it.

Also not discussed is a 7X version---7 times more concentrated, that can be obtained by a distributor in California---number is 408-612-4508. This material is used in hard 4th stage cases when many other protocols have failed. BIRM is also as I wrote, useful to take when doing chemo, as there are many reports of reduction of side effects due to the Chemo.

Nalakrats

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I have taken BIRM concentrate (3ml twice daily) since Dec 2016. My psa has dropped and is stabilised around 3.5 3.8. I read the research and my surgeon is comfortable with the current watch and see regime. My psa is checked three monthly and has been stable as noted for over a year.

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I am Undetectable for 22 months while taking BIRM---but I also was on ADT and other materials. I am on ADT vacation now--but continue to take all my other Materials and Supplements--I do nor recommend taking anything---as I am not a Doctor---But personally had found the use of Pectasol-C with the taking of BIRM, may have had a positive impact in my rare case of Pca,

Nalakrats

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By the way don't buy it from Amazon, I think they do not sell the concentrate. Contact BIRM directly and they will advise a dose and provide the product directly out of the US.

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How do you contact BIRM directly?

Richard

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Or call 408-612-4508--an authorized distributor in California---they have both 1X and 7X.

Nalakrats

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Husband started birm two days ago and have diahrhea. Not sure if this is from birm???

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See reply below.

Nalakrats

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Here is the address from Paypal invoice.

BIRM Products Maria Fernanda Reyes PO Box 13113 Coyote, CA 95013 United States Phone: 408-612-4508 usa@ecuabirm.com WWW.BIRMproducts.com

The concentrate is US$126/bottle for 120ml. A bottle lasts me about 20 days. I order 2 at a time. They ship quickly. I am in New Zealand, order when I open my last bottle and the new supply is here well in time.

I initially contacted Dr Cevalos (oncologist) in Ecuador around Dec 2016/Jan 2017 who set the dose. They responded very quickly. I suggest you do the same. Can't hurt. Consultas Birm [consultas@birm.com.ec]

At the time I had the following status: I had had a trans perineal ultrasound guided prostate biopsy that has shown at least one small lesion which returned a Gleason score of 3+4 and places me in Group 2 under the new grouping range. My last PSA at the time was 7.3.

PSA rates -

26-Oct-16 8.5 6-Dec-16 7.3 6-Jan-17 3.8 3-Feb-17 3.8 4-May-17 3.3 31-Jul-17 3.7 12-Oct-17 3.83 16-Jan-18 3.4

You can see that the reading went down to within normal range (I am 69) almost immediately. I am not on any other medication.

Hope this helps. Tim

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Reading the clinical article, BIRM sounds great. How do you study potential interactions with what you are already taking. For example, since BIRM interacts with the mechanism of the AR , does it interact with Xtandi, which also interacts with AR in a complex manner?

Seems BIRMs potency, if I read properly, is a function of DHT level, how does the use of dutasteride interact with BIRM?

Seems impossible to understand how may interact with other supplements, ie, curcumin , resveratrol, pomegranate, except Nal , i think takes those and seems ok.

Where do you go to study such interactions for exotic supplements?

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Nowhere at present. You know when I say I am not a Doctor, but I play one at home---I try to use all the years I have in Organic Synthesis Chemistry, Food Science, and Food Chemistry, which gets involved in individual ingested molecules traversing the body. But in this case it is an intuitive guess along with Heavenly Support, thru Prayer.

Also understand Prostate Cancer was a last Cancer for BIRM to be used on--it started with Lung, Colon, and Kidney and cancer--where there was no concern about AR's and the use of Avodart to keep DHT from forming from T. Well to complicated, as there are probably well over a hundred compounds in a BIRM extract.

Nalakrats

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I ordered from amazon but have a friend in Ecuador that can send me birm from her pharmacy. How do I know the concentration? It’s 44$ in Quito.

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If it is that high in one of my Favorite Cities to visit---I would expect you are getting the 7X concentration---package info--should help---because I can get for 48 dollars the single strength in the USA. The 7X is 126 dollars--so I expect you are getting the 7X.

Nalakrats

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FYI and BIRM.. My husband takes BIRM every day and he has neuroendocrine Prostate Cancer. He has responded well to treatment and his last scan was good. He takes the concentrated version. I just email them and they paypal invoice me. It works fine and they are fast at shipping. I hope this testimonial helps someone! I am praying for you all!

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You ought to create a Post--and let that be a Testimonial---men are dying of Neuroendrocrine---please post--I need your support here.

Nalakrats

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I will do this.. but I am a little worried about tempting fate. Our last scan was good and numbers were good and I hope this will continue but cancer has a way of being unpredictable.

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How much do you pay for the concentrate?

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I think it is about $126 or so dollars a bottle for the concentrated. It is not cheap. But with Neuroendocrine I wanted to try it. I email them. If you go to the web site ecuabirm.com remember to click on the flag that looks kind of British.. that way the web site is in English. The shipping was very prompt and it gets to my house in a couple of days.

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126 to a California Distributor.

Nalakrats

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I once knew a Gnu...

Good Luck and Good Health.

j-o-h-n Monday 03/05/2018 4:23 PM EST

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I'm just wondering.... Amazon was okay to purchase BIRM....... and now it's not??

Jackie

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You can call 408 612 4508

Nalakrats

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Thank you Nal ☺

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I had my friend go to the pharmacy in Ecuador. It’s $45.00 and the same strength as on amazon for $48.00. I wanted to try the lighter strength first as I wasn’t sure how my husband would react to birm. He seems to be fine so I will order 7 strength next time.

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I was just reporting not prescribing---Hope you get benefits. I think I have.

Nalakrats

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Would BIRM be safe to use along with the drug Apalutimide?

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IMO yes--but I am not a Doctor--so I cannot recommend. You would have to do your own research.

Nalakrats

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Thanks!

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